Discussion in 'Abarth' started by nkrishnap, Oct 25, 2015.
thanks for u r valuable reply friends
@prabhjot @acechip @vinit @PradeepM @Turbothinghy and all others who contributed to this subject:
Thank you guys. It makes me proud to be part of such an active community. Forget the rest of the world, we have one other world here. It looks like T-jet is the best, and multijet being so close. This will, for sure, help me buy the right jet - clearing all confusions.
I apologize for the delay, however, am watching the replies and yes- the instant reply from Prabhojot at 1 AM same day, but couldn't come back as I was busy upgarding MY12 punto. I changed the tyres to Michelin, and yes the alloys upgraded.
One quick question: Am going through - "http://www.prodieselchip.in" and found they have some tuning chips for multijet 75hp. The torque mentioned is at 147, but is that with a different "UOM"? I remember the torque being "197nm" for the 75hp. Also, which would be the best re-map for 75hp or tuning chip just fine? Any adverse affects in installing such a device and then - can we notice considerable change
@acechip : I agree with you on the clutch and brake pads, and yes, in our nation; we need to be very very careful with the throttle and 120 should be good. Sometimes, we can't resist the temptation though. Still working on it, but I agree with you 100% and Fiat is such a place in which we won't realize the actual speed; while that can land us in more complicated situation.
@prabhjot , @acechip @vinit @Turbothingy Guys, I just saw Merc launch the updated A class which has an insanely powerful 121 BHP engine for 24 L. obviously the interiors are a world apart and together with fancy gizmos and safety (6 airbags) and all makes it look and feel a class apart.
I am just wondering, how difficult it would be for Fiat to release a car with all these kinks (which are important kinks) sorted out so that we have a truly world class machine that looks and feels like one. Let it not sell but we start highlighting the fact that it is so reasonable and so world class. I remember Bajaj when they released the KTM had made a slide comparing it to all it's competitors and proving that they were better than the Ninja's, Honda's and so on. The rest as we all know is history.
p.s. I should really apply for a job at Fiat.
KTM is anything but a quality product. Its pretty poor in quality.
Bro, its a sin to compare a Merc with a Fiat. Their brand equity and positioning is poles apart. Merc, earlier sold A-class diesel with a mere 105 bhp, 250 NM engine, but it sold like others in the segment.
Fiat Punto Abarth with all those 'important kinks' would still be far from a perfect car, because again people would say, the ergonomics suck, rear space sucks, and the list would go on and on. Go to T-BHP, there some people are already saying, that that Abarth decal sucks, I mean cant you just get them removed??
Instead of bashing Fiat, so as to what Fiat could have done, lets appreciate Fiat for doing something, no other manufacturer dared to do.
@Turbothingy I understand the difference in brand - however you have to admit that the gear is a really big weak link and the interiors are not even close to i20 Elite range. That can be improved correct?
Bro no car is perfect, not even near perfect, specially in sub 10 lakhs category. There are things in which Punto is better and there are things in which i20 is better. All the manufacturers have their respective USPs.
You know what before driving a Punto, I used to drive Esteem at home, and i was very happy with its performance, but on the highway its steering used to become a joystick. At that time, I thought this is bound to happen until you arent driving a Merc, BMW or an Audi. I belonged to that 'aam junta' (Mango men) category. But when I drove a Punto I was taken aback with its ultra-precise steering and superior handling.
IMO, even i20 has a joystick like lifeless steering which is not a deterrent to a mango man. I totally agree, that the interiors are of better quality, has snappy gearshift and I might would also have gone for an i20 if I wouldnt have driven a Punto before, but Fiat's USPs are more driver oriented when compared to Hyundai's.
So, yes Fiat needs to improve its gearbox (which they are currently doing), but at the same time Hyundai also needs to improve or further improve a lot of other things. Hyundai sells in 5 digits just because its USPs are bang on wrt the masses.
The scary bit is that this negligible sales-effect is despite the 'Crafted for Car Lovers' campaign as also very very wide dissemination of the Abarth ads and reviews and near-universal acclaim.
VERY dispiriting because it suggests that EVEN very/all-new product/models (i.e., the Abarth-s) just cannot break out of the awful rut for the BRAND.
One hopes the all-new 2017 models have big, assured exports baked-in, because they sure aren't going to be selling better-enough than the current cars, given the 'market's' state of mind-made-up and indifferent-or-hostile-feeling? T-jet or not, ddct or not, 1.5 mjd or not, better ergonomics and rear-space or not.
The JEEP brand is also in danger of being freighted in-advance and prejudicially and distrustingly by the awful inertia of the FIAT brand in India. Still, the two brands+Abarth should be retailed and serviced together IMO, in the most important cities, to which should also be added the new Alfa-s asap. Perhaps that will be enabling for both brands to help overcome the reluctance or, is it not, outright phobia for Fiat-s in india? And as insurance: export-first-and-foremost models.
Of course Tata, Chevy, Nissan, VW, Skoda and even Ford+Toyota (financially) are not in any ship-shape either, in India, AT ALL. And they too will be re-launching themselves at this Maruti+HY+Honda dominated market at the same time as Fiat and Jeep (2017-18). So the going's going to remain just as arduous as it is now.
@prabhjot What campaign? You tube and an ad where there are a lot of "white folks running around". Nope they have not advertised and please be honest - the Abarth has received good reviews from every quarter including folks in the friendly horse forum couple of whom have already bought the Abarth. what folks are asking is not out of the world - the older Punto had extremely poor interiors and speakers (they have improved in the current EVO) but the first thing that sells is looks. Rest comes later - that is human tendency.
It is NOT product attributes or mis-attributes or mis-attributions that are the problem.
And they have indeed advertized: the Crafted for Car (which had no 'white folks...') Lovers ads has been on billbooards, on tv, in print. The Abarth ad has got a million and 4 lakh views. etc.
Time then to giveup on the misapprehension that 'it is their fault', and accept that next-to-nobody's interested in FIAT the brand, t-jet or not, etc etc.
Nobody is asking for this or that: nobody's interested or open-enough to. If you still think that the 'issue' is the gearshift feel and dashboard-plastic, and that there'll be the slightest uptick in interest or sales if they are 'addressed': wrong. They should in any case, of course, but it won't change squat.
And look and feel of FIATs is the least of the problems as far as the brand's sales goes. The cars look fab on the outside and have great design on the inside too if not uber-soft plastic everywhere, but then which of the bestsellers does?
When they said 'sepearte dealers': done. When they said: updated cars, done. When they said: better engine tuning and t-jet, Abarth too, done. When they said: much nicer interiors, done. When they said: more and better marketing, done to a notable degree (from the 'make the move' ads to the 'happy life' one to this 'crafted for car lovers' one): done. Prices were always way-better than the competition.
NO positive effect whatsoever. In fact: negative. Now, the last demand is fully all-new models, that'll do the trick!
It won't. And we'll be latching on to this or that irrelevant detail about the cars or the advertizements to berate FIAT, or just to bewilderingly explain the failure-to-sell, still, in 2017.
Good luck FIAT changing anyone's closed-mind in this market.
Kevin Flynn needs to get the message across to Mike Manley and Marchionne: the only way FIAT will benefit from its continued presence in India will be as a rather profitable technology supplier, contract manufacturer, exporter, and maybe a bit with JEEP. Not as a brand.
The brand itself has nearzero prospects in india, even with the all-new Punto, 1.5 mjd etc in 2017. And there's little to nothing they can do about it.
FIAT/fca should 'make in india' in order first and foremost to 'sell outside India'. 'Sell in india' can at best be a sideshow for them, if that.
Chevy, Nissan, VW+Skoda and Ford are in a not-dissimilar position in india too: india as export-base first, and as retail-sales-market a distant second. And TATA's turnaround, if it happens, will take several years too. These firms will endlessly struggle here against MS and HY, mainly. FIAT, for historical stigma reasons, most of all.
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