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Discussion in 'Car Purchase Queries' started by Manilruben, Aug 6, 2010.

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  1. kaps

    kaps Superiore

    Agree. Anybody who sinks his money in any product, will find numerous reasons to justify his purchase and even show his purchase decision as superior. Human nature. Going through some polo owners thread, brings a smile on my face when Polo owners go gaga over some features that I used to enjoy even in my Uno (double crank protection, curved wiper bades, to name a few). Bottom line, anyone spending money will think he knows best.
  2. Paliofan

    Paliofan Timido

    Punto has better rear seat legroom and headroom. Personal experience. I'm using my company's Polo car for the last few days, and I have even used the Grande Punto also. Infact, I have used the rear seats of Punto and Polo back to back and the Punto is a clear winner.

    EDIT: Grammatical errors/
  3. sdp1975

    sdp1975 Amatore

    OT, but how 'hot' is the Polo 1.6 ? There are 2 reports on t-bhp complaining of poor low-end torque. Because of BS-IV ?

    Is there really no hot petrol hatch out there in the market ? :A
  4. PaddleShifter

    PaddleShifter Staff Member Janitor

    Grande Punto 1.3
    McLaren, but GTX/S10 was still one of the safest Indian hatch because of tank like build quality, being a Fiat of course. ::T
    If there were no airbags/ABS, other cars in India did not offer any such feature either. At least, S10 was build solid.

    Even Palio Stile is very safe in this aspect. There is thread on team-bhp about an owner's experience with Palio Stile that saved 4 lives including his on the highway.

    MULTIJET Timido

    Navi Mumbai
    Some models of Palio 1.6 GTX used to come with Airbag and ABS(I have driven). No clear idea bout S10.
  6. sdp1975

    sdp1975 Amatore

    The GTX SP ( sports ) used to come with airbags and ABS - it was the first in it's segment to offer abs/airbags. The S10 never came with abs/airbags.

    Doesn't the Fiesta 1.6 motor have better low end grunt and free revving than the Polo, max torque is at 2000 rpm. Don't know the Polo specs though.
  7. PaddleShifter

    PaddleShifter Staff Member Janitor

    Grande Punto 1.3
    Ok. I used to believe that Swift ZXi was introduced later and earlier only LXi and VXi used to be offered.

    Also, Matiz had a good safety record. The crash tests had a good result and especially the 40% offset crash test or something I read back in 1999 when I was a kid.
    The Stile I'm talking about had a high speed collision with an Indica that was standing in the middle of the highway at night because the Indica passengers had stopped to help another car that had met with an accident but did not park their own Indica safely.

    Agreed on most points you have highlighted. Thanks! ::T
  8. VahanPujari

    VahanPujari Staff Member Janitor

    Don't want to get into a debate which car is better - Polo or Punto. Am not gonna in the market to buy anyone of these nor am inclined to judge any 1 car over the other. However, I felt it pertinent to respond to a few posts here to show how the same message can be written completely differently from the eye of someone who hates Punto/ Fiat and/ or someone who hates Polo - i.e. same message from 2 different viewpoints. Lets see.
    Sometimes its acceleration, sometimes its bhp figures - as per what is convenient, right? If BHP is higher, talk about acceleration. If in-gear/ acceleration is higher, talk about BHP numbers. If nothing else, talk about Power-to-weight ratio. Thats the usual mantra. Coming back to power-to-weight ratio & the performance figures, even < 80 bhp NHC & < 70bhp Fiesta were there & still never considered underpowered. On the other hand Esteem 2nd gear acceleration was too good. So? On the other hand there is Cruze and other such cars with oodles of bhp's but where is the acceleration (initial turbo lag).
    Thats not the point. Is it? The point is what are the advantages / reasons of giving 3 pot engine? 2 prime advantages are FE & Cost saving. Polo gives none of these over Punto. 3 pot engine would have been perfectly alright had Polo was offered at SUBSTANTIALLY lower price AND gave SUBSTANTIALLY higher FE. Sadly, it doesn't give any of these 2. Sadly, its becoming a norm for MNC manufacturers to dump 3 pot engines without any clear advantages it offers - Nissan Micra joins the bandwagon.

    However, refined Polo 3 pot engine is, still its 3 pot engine. Period. Technology has moved on. With refinement, if 3 pot engine does not offer the clear advantages, whats the use/ objective of offering it?

    Against that, if a 4 cylinder newer engine matches the price & FE of a 3 pot engine, which is more advantageous?

    My view is that if there is nothing wrong with 3 pot engine, the same should be offered with SUBSTANTIALLY lower cost. SUBSTANTIALLY. And with much much higher FE.
    How can it be an even match? Who stopped Polo to give 195 spec tyres? If it gives 185 tyres, it has to own the advantages or disadvantages because of that? Don't tell me that one HAS TO straight away change the tyres if he buys a Polo. Hardly 2-4% people do it & it brings extra cost - can not be apple-to-apple comparison.
    Remembering the example you quoted somewhere how wafer-thin, feather-light Maruti models are ruling the market. All said & done, as even you agreed HPS are any day better than useless, video-game like EPS steering.
    I have stated the FE figures for the Polo & Punto above.[/quote:27cu7k9r]
    All said & done, why a 3 pot engine Polo can't give much higher (3 to 4 kmpl higher) FE than a 4 cylinder engine much heavier car?
    Assuming? No Free service, even 1st & 2nd service charged at Rs. 6K to 8K coupled with only 40-odd service station pan India & higher spare parts cost, can we say that people are "assuming" ? The right words to my mind are "Sure unless some miracle happens".
    If you read such "sore" stories, invariably you would find that the owner who faced the issue & was irate finally ends up showering all the accolades on Fiat how they helped & solved. Atleast I observed it in most of the cases. Also, Fiat's commitment to owners is also clearly visible when they offer the parts under warranty which are even not covered under warranty. On the other hand, there are horror stories that customers have to fight tooth & nail to claim their rightful warranty with the other "acclaimed" manufacturers leave aside VW-like MNCs like Skoda, Honda etc.
    I have seen Fiat owners rave to no ends that the Puntos houses the "award winning engine of the year". Let me just point out that the Polo has just won "2010 car of the year award" internationally. That in itself should speak volumes about the Polo?[/quote:27cu7k9r]
    Internationally is the key word. Isn't it? There are many examples of cars which is acclaimed internationally but failed miserably in India
    Yes, I was disheartened to see that even the 1.6 Polo did not come with ACC. A minus to the VW on this front. [/quote:27cu7k9r]
    It can be said like this - A 3 pot engine car with Price not lower but equal or more, still skimping on features like ACC (and many more other features/ equipments) and not giving substantially higher FE smells clear arrogance.
    Yes, I agree on that. But the novelty of Blue & Me will wear off after a while. Atleast for someone like me. But yes, its features like these the Punto scores over the Polo. [/quote:27cu7k9r]
    I guess, Fiat was the 1st to bring such new features in these segments of cars. Heck, even a much lower priced Figo now offers it !! While Fiat tried to offer new innovative items to Indian customers, VW tried to skimp even the standard (forget new) features like ACC/ steering mounted controls etc etc. Thats the difference & thats why it smells arrogance.
    Even I have no clue what VW was thinking with this one. Seriously. [/quote:27cu7k9r]
    1 more to add. The list of skimping on features/ equipments goes on & on.

    Aah. Very tame excuse. Isn't it? How many people change tyres & Audio? Less than 5%. To deprive 95% people because of 5% people is not a common sense. But yeah. Its a business sense of saving cost surely !!

    Also, by the same token, there are quite a few people install LPG/ CNG kit in their cars immediately after buying it (Check Gujarat & other such territories)- does that mean why companies are giving Petrol Engines senselessly?

    Another point - In Punto, if you want ICE upgrade, you have an option of choosing Active variant. In Polo, if you want Steering mounted controls, do you have an option even on the highest variant ? NO. Does VW/ Polo indirectly say - Get off you useless fellow, you don't even know that you got to change ICE & Tyres straight after you buy the car from us because what we offer is useless ?

    To summarize- Polo at equal or more price, offers following compared to Punto:

    • 3 pot engine however refined it is[/*:m:27cu7k9r]
    • No clear Price advantage with 3 pot engine.[/*:m:27cu7k9r]
    • No clear FE advantage. Why can't it offer 3-4 kmpl higher FE giving 3 pot engine?[/*:m:27cu7k9r]
    • No ACC[/*:m:27cu7k9r]
    • No Blue & Me[/*:m:27cu7k9r]
    • No Steering Mounted Controls[/*:m:27cu7k9r]
    • No Electronic ORVM adjustment.[/*:m:27cu7k9r]
    • No Free service. Figures for 1st & 2nd service quoted by some members here are Rs. 6K to 10 K each service.[/*:m:27cu7k9r]
    • No advantage in acceleration[/*:m:27cu7k9r]
    • No advantage in Ride & Handling combination.[/*:m:27cu7k9r]
    • Higher Spare Parts prices.[/*:m:27cu7k9r]
    • Only 40-odd service station network Pan India.[/*:m:27cu7k9r]
    • No HPS steering[/*:m:27cu7k9r]
    • ....[/*:m:27cu7k9r]
    • ....[/*:m:27cu7k9r]

    It smells arrogance. Doesn't it?
  9. PaddleShifter

    PaddleShifter Staff Member Janitor

    Grande Punto 1.3
    In fact, I had been conservative in my approach till now. Hey, I've many things to report between these two cars. No car is perfect and complete. Punto smokes Polo every time. Linea smokes Mid-Size Sedans so much so that competition came up with some things against Linea and Punto and now these are in the mind of people who read a few reviews online before going to check out the car themselves.

    ANHC and Linea have comparable interiors. Yet, Linea is bashed for bad interiors and ANHC is a Honda badge product.

    NHC had similar power figures but was just criticized, never bashed like Linea. Because it was a Honda.

    Punto has nothing great quality interior plastic but so do every other hatch except i20, Polo and Fabia. Hey, and what about design? Does Jazz come anywhere near Punto when it comes to the design of the dash?

    Swift has plain dash. Yet, a person will say he felt Punto had bad interiors and he bought Swift. Lame excuse.

    I've read some 250+ ownership reviews on various forums. At a point, when a person compares the cars he saw and TDed, and then then justifies his decision, everyone says that Punto had bad interiors. He might have bought Swift in the end. What is the luxury quality in Swift's interiors that he did not find in Punto?

    A guy says he got ANHC. When he went to see Linea, it had bad interiors and he was let down by them. But, the same guy was a fan of NHC as well. Where was his dislike for low power at that time? Whoa! My ANHC friend was speechless to see Linea's features. He said it's a mini Audi with those DIS features & Blue&Me. Interior plastic is similar. ANHC has more power though.

    Good point. And, I would like to say that even though Figo offers Bluetooth, it is no match for the Blue&Me. I've seen many people speechless after they see a car "talk" to them. But, Fiat does not know how to highlight it. Figo ad shows that how the guy presses a button on the dash to take a call. Punto ad on the other hand shows the guy using his phone to dial the no. and then press the Microsoft button to talk to the police.

    If you want ICE upgrades, you have Active, Dynamic, Emotion. You have Emotion pack as well if you got the heart of doing away with Blue&Me and steering controls. Moreover, even speaker upgrade works wonders. There is no need of changing HU.
    What is the meaning of "Highline" if there are no "High" features. Not even steering controls. I don't think that plain steering of Polo has Leather wrapping as well. I think either VW was "high" while naming it highline or they think Indians will be "high" while buying a top variant.

    Why are people letting go of badi gaadi like Ford Ikon or Logan and buy the so called "Premium hatch".
    Because a premium hatch is supposed to carry all the Gizmos of 21st Century.

    It is to enjoy the features/convenience offered by luxury cars at a smaller price and a compact car suitable for city driving and parking.

    14" spare tyre with 15" alloys on top variant.
    No auto door locks
    Flawed manual door lock mechanism
    Cramped rear seat with lesser head room.
  10. PaddleShifter

    PaddleShifter Staff Member Janitor

    Grande Punto 1.3
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