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Peted, K&Ned, 1,76,000 Kilometers completed

Discussion in 'Punto 1.3 MJD' started by epicenter, Jun 11, 2010.

  1. Mandeep Paaji,

    Last Saturday I had been to Reliance autozone Kanakapur road Bangalore, I saw KN filter flow demonstration kit and lots of Air filters of K&N, I almost decided to buy one for punto but some how I was skeptical.
    One menant for Punto/linea was costing Rs 5290/-

    Asked the Shop manager to let me test the filtration capabilities of K&N as filtration of the dirt is is filter primary duty, he refused too allow me to use talcum powder test.

    I just opened a Filter and held it against light (CFL) I was shocked to see holes as much as tip of a needle!!
    Just take look the following links

    http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/airfilter/airtest3.htm

    http://www.autoblog.com/2005/09/07/how-well-do-k-n-air-filters-work/

    http://forums.automobilemag.com/70/...k-n-filters-can-cost-you-thousands/index.html

    http://www.8thcivic.com/forums/civic-si/86189-review-k-n-high-flow-drop-air-filter-07-si.html

    here in this forum, there is suggestion to cover K&N filter with uni foam to increase it's filtration ability.

    http://www.thumpertalk.com/forum/archive/index.php/t-275885.html

    I feel foam filters are little better than using cotton gauze filter, as they are used primarily in off road vehicles where the dust is more.

    Foam filter do allow 30-50% more air than paper filters and traps dust as good or little better.

    Think about the long term damage caused by dirt particles to your car's engine.

    -Sat
    Last edited: May 24, 2011
  2. Pran

    Pran Superiore

    Messages:
    748
    Bangalore
    Grande Punto 1.3
    For my kind of usage considering 25-30k km a year, it means 2 filter changes a year = 600/-. If I use my car for 5 years, thats 5 * 600 = 3000/-. So how can someone like me justify the expensive K&N filters. Many who have used it says that there is nothing much on the performance side and on top of that the filtering capability is being questioned. May be it is useful when one opt for remap or tuning boxes, but definitely not for the stock engines. Thanks Sat for these links.
  3. jumu

    jumu Superiore

    Messages:
    969
    Chennai
    How about peeling off and using the bottom most layer of felt filter found in the stock fiat air filter, under the K & N filter so that we get the benefit of more air as well as filtered air that meets FIAT specs.Has anyone tried ? I do want to try it on my KN stuff I have with me, may be not immediately. Bit busy these days but the idea just struck me now. Do I sound weird?? Your comments please

    Abdul
  4. epicenter

    epicenter Amatore

    Messages:
    158
    Valsad, India
    hey guys
    sorry for not writing in for a very long time.
    have been busy doing up the 500 since some time now and had been facing some reliability issues.
    the car has been serviced for the 75k period and now crossed 78000 kilometers. lot of things to discuss.
    will be putting up all the details and answering sat paji and jumus questions in a couple of days.
    till then, drive safe and always wear a seatbelt.
  5. epicenter

    epicenter Amatore

    Messages:
    158
    Valsad, India
    any suspension setup has to be changed as a complete set of four.
    this will set me back by around 40 odd thousand rupees.
    drive safe, always wear a seatbelt!!
  6. epicenter

    epicenter Amatore

    Messages:
    158
    Valsad, India
    sat paji,
    first of all sorry for the delay in replying.
    now coming to the point.
    the filter was a demo one, which in most of the cases would be more mishandled than handled.
    in that case pinholes were a very small thing that had happened to the filter.
    i have been using the k&n since the swift and trust me nothing like this either is seen when you open up a box packed filter or even if you use it in your car and wash and clean it regularly with low pressure tap water, air dry it and oil it and use it again.
    i'll not advocate the k&n but most of the cotton wool/wire mesh air filters work on this principle only.
    ive have put up extensive reports of how to clean the filter and also some pics that show the dirt clogging the filter. trust me, when i wash and clean the filter, i go through its folds with an eagle eye. i have not seen pinholes like you mention. ofcourse, at a couple of places, the cotton wool is displaced from its place and does make chinks through which light is visible, but then they have to be oiled again and the oil does take care of those chinks. once the filter starts doing its part of filtering the air, the oil catches the dirt and fills up the voids.
    i havent had a lot of experience with foam filters but i can say one thing, a swift running a pipercross foam filter and a swift running a k&n are way different in acceleration. foam filters will never clean up properly because of the way they are built, with dirt and dust clogging the air tunnels that run through them, if not completely then to some point.
    one thing to note is that not only k&ns but any and all cotton/wire mesh filters wouldnt be around for this long a time if they were not performing would they?
    think about it.
    and wear a seatbelt while you think when driving.

    pran,
    if you start calculating everything in usage per kilometer per year, you definitely dont want to have fun with your car.
    i am using a friends stock car with only a k&n without a performance exhaust or a tuning box and trust me, the car runs.
    anyways, its your prerogative how you want to interpret a lot of things.

    Abdul sir,
    you would almost be running a stock filter if you did that. almost.
    but since you have put the seed in my mind, i wouldnt mind trying it for you.
    i have about 6 stock filters lying with me and i cleaned up my k&n a couple of days back and its still waitinig to go back in the car so i can do the test and get back to you with what the results are. just give me a couple of days for that.
    by the way, have you used the k&n filter grease to seal your filter completely when the lid goes back on the filter box?
    it does make a difference.
    till then, drive safe, always wear a seatbelt.
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 27, 2011
  7. epicenter

    epicenter Amatore

    Messages:
    158
    Valsad, India
    78000 kilometers and Still Going Strong

    so now that the queries are done with, some more updates on the car.
    couldnt write in earlier because of a very heavy work schedule coupled to a motorcycle being painted and an engine being custom rebuilt which took a toll.
    the car was having some issues in the mornings during the first start. as soon as the engine cranked up, the mid beeped and the engine check light would go on. the engine revolutions would jiggle a bit from 800 to 900 rpm and come back in line and the beep would continue.
    had to switch the car off and turn it back again to get rid of the problem. but it was just a work around and everytime it happened, a beep in the back of my skull said, "EGR needs cleaning!!!"
    even the car performance had deteriorated and while i didnt notice anything, a friend had noted black smoke billowing from the exhaust a couple of times during hard acceleration while he was tailing me in his punto. cause of concern ofcourse and the EGR trouble was confirmed too.
    so finally managed to give the car for service at a little over 75500 kilometers. told the guy to specifically do up the EGR and everything else could be forgotten if they didnt have the time to do it. they said theyd do everything i'd asked them to put on the jobcard.
    it also included servicing the clutch slave cylinder. the gears had been getting a bit hard to engage since the last few days and even the clutch felt heavier.
    leaving the babe at the workshop and after a warning about instilling the wrath of god into one and all who were going to work on my car, i left.
    got a call at around 6.30 in the evening saying that the car was complete and was being washed. i told them to hold polishing the interiors of the car and go ahead with everything else, prepare a credit invoice and leave the car at the maingate as i'd be late in getting to the workshop. ok sir, that was the answer.
    8.40 i was at the workshop and the car and i were eyeing each other with apprehension.
    getting the key into the ignition, i switched on to the accessories till all the system lights went out. a little further and the engine shrugged and purred to life. it actually purred to life. the engine had smoothened down to such an extent it was hard to believe i was sitting in the seat of my own car. grinning from ear to ear i depressed the clutch pedal. heaven. the pedal was so light, i could almost press it with a feather.
    slotting the car into reverse, i slowly wangled it out of the parking space and shifted to the first.
    since i shift very quickly to the 2nd, i couldnt find any difference in the acceleration there but as soon as i let out the clutch on the second and let my foot down on the accelerator pedal, the world out of the window was a blur.
    60 came up in the blink of an eye and before i knew, i had already slotted into the fourth and was crossing the 120 mark. splendid.
    decided to see whether the car would perform like new. it bettered it with the speedo needle going to the 140 mark in the 4th gear. just like the time when we had test driven the car after the exhaust fitment. awesome was the only word in my mind.
    since the diesel light was showing, decided to tank up and reached home. the highway was a bit trafic oriented so decided to leave the endurance run till the next day.
    the bill had come to about 8k with all the fluids changed, the egr valve serviced and everything else thrown in.
    morning came and i just coudnt wait to go to office. i'd be driving the car to its limits, almost, today.
    the car started again with the engine purring softly and the thrumming exhaust the only evidence of the power to be unleashed by this multijet engine.
    heading to the highway and negotiating the first 30 kilometers of so took well over 40 minutes. i was getting impatient as the odo needle barely crossed the 80 mark. the only consolation was that this figure came up really fast.
    crossing the tax limits of gujarat, i headed onto the nh 8 towards talasari where the traffic is considerably less and the roads, wide open stretches with amazing undulations and turns.
    slamming my foot on the accelerator, it felt like the car was going to leap out of its skin and head northwards. it was so damn fast, i couldnt believe it. it usually happens that when you drive the same car day in and day out, you tend to take the speeds and the performance of the car for granted and you can only feel the difference when you actually start thinking about it.
    crossing the 140 mark on the climb towards the top of an undulation, i shifted to the 5th. the car still had juice to surge to 150 and the needle kept going on and on, but then it stopped making a difference as the car was now descending.
    on a couple of flats where i was driving flat out, managed to see the accelerator needle nudging the 170 mark and also a grin on my face.
    all in all the service guys had done a good job and i called them up to tell them the same.
    the only problem left unsolved was that my upper beams were playing hide and seek and had a mind of their own. they only worked in the daytime and as soon as i wanted them at night, they stopped working.
    finally figured it out to a sticky relay on the harness and changed it. cost me about 190 bucks.
    the car has travelled around 3 odd thousand kilometers and still performs like a gem.
    i've planned to go for the same size of tires as i have now. the bilsteins will have to take a backseat as of now and i may go in for them after a couple of months.
    also in the pipe line is a trip to ladakh and if everything goes on alright, then i am heading for the hills on the 2nd of August this year.
    Keep on watching this space for more updates.
    Till then, keep driving and always wear a seatbelt.
  8. karan desai

    karan desai Superiore

    Messages:
    805
    Morbi, Gujrat
    hey epicentre good to know that your car is trouble free now and you are back to enjoying the car. and i never knew you are from gujarat. kem che baki maja mane. what i make out is that though fiat has not mentioned certain things in the service schedule the car needs it.
  9. Ravi

    Ravi Staff Member Janitor

    Messages:
    6,001
    Bangalore
    Grande Punto 1.3
    Excellent post Mandeep.
    Nice to see after 78K also car is making you happy. Your earlier post about some reliability made me curious to read full post.

    BTW, what made you to get EGR cleaned?
  10. nkapoor777

    nkapoor777 Regolare

    Messages:
    467
    New Delhi
    Thanks Mandeep for keeping this thread updated with minute details about the performance and running of the car; really appreciate the efforts. This thread is pretty much a reference point for a lot of us since your running is so far ahead of us. I'm close to 40k in my Punto and have decided to go for a service at 10k interval from now on. And I have also felt that the clutch has gone quite hard and would need attention in the upcoming 40k service (in another 15 days time). Also, the manual specifies that all fluids (coolant, clutch, brake, power steering, transmission) need to be replaced every 2 years or 60k kms, whichever is earlier. But I haven't heard any TASS recommend or perform this for any of the cars which have completed the said time/running interval. In fact, when I asked a couple of them here in Delhi-NCR, they said they are not aware of it. I intend to change all fluids with the 40k service as well in the hope to keep the multijet purring along as happily as possible.

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