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Need Help on Timing Chain Kit and Clutch Kit

Discussion in 'Technical' started by anindyodutta, Dec 6, 2014.

  1. I just came back after dropping my car off at the Butta Automotive workshop in Hyderabad.
    A service advisor named Raju/Rajeev is attending to my car.

    I told him about a few issues I am facing and he called me back a few minutes ago telling me that there is a sound in the Engine at the time of start up, and most likely a part/kit called the turning kit needs replacement. He mentioned this is a part of the engine which has a chain drive, and a couple of gear wheels, and there is possibly some play in the gears that is the reason for this sound. I want to understand what this turning kit is for and what is the typical life span of the parts in this kit.
    I also complained about the gears getting very hard to shift recently, and he is suggesting replacement of the clutch kit.
    He is also going to replace the air filter, engine oil and filter, a glow plug, fuel filter, with wheel balancing, alignment as part of the 60K Kms service, for which he quoted ~Rs. 9000.
    He has quoted another Rs. 8000 for the Turning kit and another Rs. 8000 inclusive of labour charges. The bill will total to about Rs. 25000, and before I ask him to go forward, I wanted to understand what I am paying for.

    Also, it would help if any of you have some feedback on Butta Automotive and its staff.
    I would greatly appreciate if any of you can share your cell phone number with me on anindyodutta@aol.com, and I will call you to speak. I will not take more than 10 minutes of your time, I promise :)

    Thanks in advance,
    Anindyo Dutta
  2. asimpleson

    asimpleson Esperto

    Linea 1.3
    The "turning kit" is actually the timing kit you are talking about. The timing chain, its gears, the plastic pad tensioners etc. It is essential to change this. You can go to Butta and ask for spare component costs and exact components they intend to change. Regarding SC review there is a separate section and user reviews perhaps if updated. Use search box to check for "butta automotive".

    Wheel alignment and balancing could be refused and gotten done from a specialist outside with good equipment and reputation. Is glow plug warning showing on scanner or LCD display. Or is there problem starting due to glow plug malfunction, do check the same before you give a go ahead. Engine oil filter, air filter and fuel filter are best if replaced. Is the car in warranty and when was it last serviced for engine oil or air filter replacement or fuel filter etc. Please mention about the history so we can guide better. Some items like timing chain are mandatory for EW warranty etc. How old is the car and which model, please mention.

    kedarbendre likes this.
  3. Hi,

    Thanks for the prompt turn around and detail, appreciate it.
    The car is a 2011 model Punto 1.3 diesel.
    The glow plug warning was flashing before I gave the car for a service, and it has happened before.
    I also had the battery replaced a week ago, and what I thought was, this turning kit was probably the chain/belt drive that couples the starter to the crank, and not sure if running the starter on a low battery would have damaged anything.
    But from what you have here, it looks like it is to maintain the timing of the engine valves through the cams (please correct if I am wrong).
    I do have extended warranty, but I am not sure how long back they were replaced
    will it cover costs of the turning kit and clutch kit under the extended warranty?

    Thanks again, and please mention your name, hard to thank someone called asimpleson.

  4. jumu

    jumu Superiore

    The glow plugs come under EW. You can ask them to change only the timing chain. Rest of the kit need not be changed (depend on wear. normally they dont wear out so easily). The charges for the oil, and filters for normal oil change it should be including labour around 6K. It shouldnt be more than 11K in chennai if it is a routine 2 years full fluid change. The timing chain costs under 2K and including labour shouldn't be more than 5K. That dealer is sniffing at ripping you. You can go through this forum for the thread on timing chain replacement. .

    You can also ask him to list out and justify the 25K estimate. Scan it to us. Let us have a look.

  5. asimpleson

    asimpleson Esperto

    Linea 1.3
    There is no turning kit it's timing kit. It turns yes, but its timing kit. Get the car error messages wiped via Examiner first, since you changed the battery. Check again if and what error messages it shows, note them down and wipe/delete them and test drive again. Rest do as Jumu/Abdul suggests, its better to guide properly that way.

    'Whats in a name...' & 'thank me no thankings...' wrote a great soul once upon a time.
    prabhjot likes this.
  6. Thanks Jumu and aSimpleSon... appreciate all the advice and help.
    I will scan the detailed bill estimate he gives me.

    I was not aware we could wipe/clear out the error messages, I will try that.

    Also, if can you tell me what else this timing kit can be, I asked the guy if it was to control cylinder valve timings he said no, and he said it is engine timing. I only knew that other than the valves petrol engines have spark plug ignitions controlled by TCI systems.
    What is this timing kit for?

    Thanks and Cheers for the weekend!
  7. asimpleson

    asimpleson Esperto

    Linea 1.3
    You can sit on passenger seat and ask the technician to perform diagnostics or read logs via examiner (scanner).

    Diesels are CI engines and yes valve timings need to be perfect in interference engines so that they do not collide with pistons when they move towards TDC position or move upwards simply put. Read Wiki article on 'interference engine.' The advisor guys themselves may not know or might give wrong explanation without realizing they do. The people who work on engines are trained mechanics and know better the procedures to carry out timing chain kit replacement. There are special tools needed to lock the engine internals and head rotary components from moving which they use so that engine timing is perfect as per manufacturer settings. Slight advanced or retard timings due to slightest deviations can result in performance and reliability and fuel economy issues later on. If timing chain breaks it can cause damages to valves and other components, including pistons depending on the level of interference in engine design and position of internal components and other factors.
    prabhjot likes this.
  8. AndyRKett

    AndyRKett Timido

    United Kingdom
    Grande Punto 1.4
    With only 60,000km on the clock I would say neither job needs doing however from reading the posts on here about timing chain failures which should be good for 320,000km breaking at 40,000km it seems a good I dear to get it done.

    However the clutch definitely shouldn't need replacement at such a low mileage.
  9. Abhinav Sharma

    Abhinav Sharma Novizio

    Grande Punto 1.3
    Does replacement of both timing kit and clutch together will save labour cost?
  10. bibin

    bibin Regolare

    @Abhinav Sharma

    it depends on the way you negotiate with the FASS, generally they give 10% discount on labor on amount above 20k.


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