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My Punto had a brain surgery, she's come out a much smarter beauty now

Discussion in 'Engine Compartment' started by theblack, May 7, 2012.

  1. pemmasg

    pemmasg Regolare

    Messages:
    359
    Chennai
    This question might have been asked by many earlier also...

    Will ECU remap takes toll on engine life? I believe the manufacturer might have made the optimised ECU map considering engine life, FE, emission noms and various other factors.
    Experts please help me to understand this.
    Looking at the theblack's experience it is very tempting for me to go for it.

    Thanks
    Gopi
  2. singh

    singh Amatore

    Messages:
    147
    Mohali
    WOW , Now that's something Interesting Read in recent times . Looking forward for prolonged use reports .
    Do keep updating .
    Nice Work
  3. Italia-Linea

    Italia-Linea Staff Member Janitor

    Messages:
    2,123
    Pune
    Great to see Siddharths work. Mainly if you are happy then the remap is perfect for your driving style.

    Any specific reason why he had to dismantle the ECU? Couldnt he do through OBD port? Did you seal the ECU back, moisture will kill the ecu.
    2 people like this.
  4. theblack

    theblack Esperto

    Messages:
    2,188
    Bangalore
    The reason for bench work on the ECU is because via the OBD port one can only flash the ECU meaning a separate map that is already written can be put into the ECU via the remap, (which is in-turn going to up the counter my +1)
    But if you want to re-write the existing file itself and save it, then it has to be opened.

    The ECU is sealed back with Anabond (if i'm right)..
    But I'm actually really apprehensive about the ECUs positioning in the car.. if you drive around for about 20mins in the sun the engine heat is so freaking much that you can bake omelettes on the ECU its that hot..
    I cannot believe that all the electrical components are subjected to such heavy temps day in and day out.

    This is a myth, without a remap too if one drives like the world is going to end tomorrow then the components will give in..
    Having said that.. There is added torque and top end power that the engine initially lacked so this might and I"m stressing "MIGHT" end up causing damage to the clutch because of more torque build up.. but that said if you're clutch would pack up at say 60000kms after the remap it might go by about 56-57k..
    That's all..

    what One needs to clearly understand is all these engines are detuned for india's wonderful conditions and our mentalities where we want more for less.
    So the brands are forced to do it that's all...

    A simple calculation (which i had given earlier also.) goes like this..
    My -'09 punto is rated at 75BHP (at the crank) .
    Lets assume that at the wheel (After all the loses) my car develops 65BHP, which means a reduction of 13%

    Now after the remap my car produces 90HP (assumption) at the crank
    So with the same losses in mind lets say my car generates 80HP at the wheel .

    NOW IS THE IMPORTANT BIT
    FIAT claims my car can handle 75BHP "when it was sold to me.."
    I"ve made it output 80BHP
    "This means an increase of 6.6%"
    Now think about it.. If a brand (FIAT/MARUTI/FORD/WHATEVER) cannot devise components that cannot handle tollerences of even 6% then i think none of these brands have the ability to be in the market.
    This is the reason why i fell remap wont kill any car.

    Also true is the fact that this 6.6% would "Probably" make some of the components pack up earlier than expected ( a few thousands of kms earlier perhaps).. But thats a choice I'm willing to make when i know that till i reach that point I'm going to enjoy my drive A LOT and love every km i clock in my beauty...

    Hopefully I've cleared doubts..

    PS:: Dont worry, getting it done by siddharth or anyone will only ruin you're engine if he/she does not know what to do with it in the first place..
    Fortunately for me Siddharth as a "Very good" idea of what he is doing.
    3 people like this.
  5. pons

    pons

    Messages:
    7
    hi the black,
    are you planning any dyno tests to know the exact increase in power.
    how many kms have you driven after remap ...another thing can you take on cars which are a class higher than punto on the highway.
    any idea about the in gear accelration times or some 0 - 100 timings
  6. Do you think for 14 BHP FIAT would have a different engine which would cost any where between $500 Million to 1 billion also the assembly line which will have different parts for same engine with same cubic capacity?
    I would have agreed if this was a 76 vs 150 BHP engine.
  7. Ganges

    Ganges Esperto

    Messages:
    3,123
    Driver Seat _/
    :
    Grande Punto 1.3
    Whatever amitp has mentioned its true to my knowledge.
  8. amitp

    amitp Amatore

    Messages:
    63
    Pune, Maharashtra
    This particular engine has a range of power outputs from 70 PS to 105 PS. That is a variation of 35 PS (which is a 50% gain over the lowest output). These are factory state numbers. The DPF (not applicable for this particular engine), EGR, Cat Con are robbing the engine of its potential for a cleaner exhaust. These power outputs are measured at the flywheel and do not consider the losses at the transmission, differential etc.
    To answer your question, I am sure FIAT can produce much more than 150 PS from that engine if there are no norms/limitations. An example for this would be the Abarth S2000 which FIAT came out with in 2005 giving out 270 BHP from a naturally aspirated 2 litre petrol engine.


    Cheers !!!

    Amit
    Last edited: Jun 11, 2012
  9. May be true may not be but it doesn't pass my cost reasoning.also 14 BHP rise can be done with out having any of those stuff mentioned there.
    Injectors used in 76 BHP can also do the duty for a 90 BHP,there will not be very different cooling required for just 14 BHP rise in power.infect a remapped 76 BHP punto can stays ahead of 90 bHP all the way upto 160 kmph but will loose after that due to a speed limiter in the ECU map.

    Is there any pointers to confirm the those differences ?
  10. amitp

    amitp Amatore

    Messages:
    63
    Pune, Maharashtra
    Hi Sat,

    There is nothing really to discuss about any cost reasoning. Fiat had multiple specs of the same engine on offer. When you are talking of a remap, kindly note that an after market modification may or may not adhere to governmental rules, regulations, guidelines etc. So hypothetically if Fiat were to come up with an after market mod, they can push the limits much farther than any individual or firm. They will be having huge data related to not only individual components but also on the relative effects of various changes on the system as a whole. At the end of it an after market remap will be highly customized for every case. A manufacturer not just makes a vehicle taking into consideration a huge variety of climates, roads and environmental conditions but also gives due consideration to variables like fuel efficiency, performance, capital cost, running cost etc and all of this fitting in the govt norms.

    I have no doubt that an after market remap will feel better to an individual as it is customized for that particular individual, but it can never ever come close to what the manufacturer makes for the masses. On a personal note there are many things that I would wish for the Punto to have, and these would be specs which Fiat had given in the past or is giving now. But will the masses be ready for it? Let me know if there is any after market firm out there which will give you warranty like a manufacturer does. Ultimately he will get you back to the stock config to claim warranty from the OEM. The simple reason is that any after market mod will not have extensive testing which can compare to an OEM and hence you will have to come back to stock config to claim warranty.

    At the best the after market warranty will remain to those specific components that have been changed and warranty on the car as a whole will be lost.


    Cheers !!!

    Amit

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