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Finally Avventura Arrived

Discussion in 'Avventura 1.3 90 HP' started by Tornado, Feb 1, 2015.

  1. acechip

    acechip Superiore

    Fiat has simply not tried enough. When they needed to push things, they restricted the sales of the T-Jet. Then they played the guessing game with the 1.6 MJD, and still continue to do so. And then they tried to distinguish the Avventura by slapping the heavy spare wheel outside, without increasing the bootspace inside. Dumb engineering, if ever. Even Renault havent dared to provide a 60-40 split/recline on the Duster rear seat, lest the customer feels the 475 litre boot space is hampered. Indians love boot space, whether they use it or not.
    And inspite of (apparently) localising the T-Jet, they are taking ages to plonk it inside the Evo/Avvy. So it is really not a case of damned if you and damned if you dont. They have been a bystander to the general passing parade, and then have never even bothered to spend the extra to be really different.
    Last edited: Apr 19, 2015
    prabhjot likes this.
  2. prabhjot

    prabhjot Esperto

    Messages:
    2,449
    delhi ncr
    @acechip

    That is true to a large degree, but as ever the question is why? not what? or even how? Mefeels it's a case of 'hell this market's really tough' or 'hell, we've had such difficulty in this market for years' and of course 'we offer Italian design+tough chassis/suspension engineering etc at killer prices but still folks here think we aren't different enough in a good way' or even just 'Marchionne etc hasn't left us with enough of risk-budget in India, now has he?'

    "What to do, what to do, the outlook is decidedly blue", as the song goes.

    Anyway, it's the future that counts, and am rather hopeful they've learnt the right lessons, the biggest one being: use India for exports FIRST, and then therefore be enabled to offer new/stronger/better stuff in the Indian local retail car baazar. And shift focus to Jeep, esp since it is a 'clean sheet' brand here.

    But yeah, there are still disturbing signs of operational 'incompetence' at FCA India, from marketing to product-planning to outright QA, and so...everything still remains to be seen.


    @Tornado : sorry for the hijack of your thread, i just realized.:oops: cheers.
    acechip likes this.
  3. Tornado

    Tornado Superiore

    Messages:
    677
    Driver's seat.
    Western Maharashtra
    Avventura 1.3 90 HP
    prabhjot likes this.
  4. acechip

    acechip Superiore

    @Tornado there is simply no denying the fact that Fiat cars are indeed great lookers, in any case they are so unique that they do attract attention anyway. There is also no denying that they are good performers. IT is the effort that Fiat is putting in to promote the overall brand that I keep questioning. All those admiring looks you get for the Avventura will not necessarily translate to sales unless Fiat promotes (rather vigorously) the good features that Avventura has. Those "flash and you are gone" ads are USELESS.

    Nor is Fiat good at "managing media". The most recent case can be seen here:

    .

    At 3.15, "Madam" eliminates 2 of the really BETTER cars in that comparo, the Linea and the Fiesta, just like that. And keeps Ciaz in the contention :banghead:
    There cant be a more glaring example of paid review than that.
    prabhjot likes this.
  5. Tornado

    Tornado Superiore

    Messages:
    677
    Driver's seat.
    Western Maharashtra
    Avventura 1.3 90 HP
    But 'managing media' means spending lot of funds and that would reflect in the price, just compare equal models of ES and Avventura, ES costs a lakh or more more than Avventura.
    Agreed, advertising is poor especially in semi urban & rural area as ASS backup is poor in these areas, though month by month they are coming up with new showrooms & FASS. Last week I noticed a new showroom & FASS at Satara(100 km from Pune on Pune - Banglore Highway.


    Few days back, one of my friend argued a lot, saying that Dezire is a better buy than Avventura (keeping aside extra GC) and swift better than punto. And she had sent Dzire SE to me.


    I had finalised Avventura & ES,but due to her persistence I called up all three SEs at the same time.

    ES SE could not justify high price.

    Dzire SE said that this is highest selling car, and you will always see a crowd eager to buy it.

    I said, there is more crowd at PMT(public transport) buses and local trains, so do you want me to travel by those?


    Then he said, their cars have got better resale value,to which fiat SE replied that customer needs to decide if he wants a better & safe car or he is interested in opening a used car shop!!!

    Dzire SE said there car is also safe, to which fiat SE responded providing this link
    https://www.google.co.in/url?sa=t&s...wQFjAA&usg=AFQjCNFCgm5GoFtRS5wfgfCL2KADMSlZIA
    And he also showed how longer servicing interval and low cost of spares makes fiat cars cheaper than Suzukis.

    Dzire SE was speechless.

    After this meeting, I told my friend that Swift or Dzire are not safe cars at speeds more than 65 kmph, to which she said her hubby drives it at 140kmph on E way since years nothing has happened till now!
    I told her that if she wants her family safe, should forward the link to her hubby and get the speed locked at 65 kmph.


    Anyways, today me with my Avventura got caught up in hailstorm near Pune, for more than 15 minutes, it was beating my car ruthlessly. My heart was in my mouth anticipating the paint damage.

    Finally when I reached home parking, anxiously checked the paint. I was delighted to notice that there is not a a scratch mark leave aside damage.
    kedarbendre, Sujit508 and prabhjot like this.
  6. acechip

    acechip Superiore

    Fiat advertising is and has been pathetic to say the least. And for this, I will blame FCA overall, not just its Indian arm. I really get a sense they are not interested in India numbers at all, apart from the token "enthusiast " presence, unlike others. It wouldnt cost Fiat , the global auto gobbler, an arm and a leg to put out 1 full pager advert or a 1 minute commercial on TV.
    It takes nothing to win over a domestic auto magazine, which is looked at with some reverence by the innocent mass car buyers.
  7. ghodlur

    ghodlur Esperto

    Messages:
    2,325
    Thane
    Although the intention was good, the design was all wrong. The spare should not have been mounted on a separate set up but made an part of the hatch door. Now the issue here was if the tyre was to be mounted on the hatch door then it couldn't have been made opening to the top which means the door design should have been modified and this would entailed an additional cost. So they decided to add another piece of mounting external to the door. This complicated the entire setup and introduced the issue right there.
  8. Whencut86

    Whencut86 Amatore

    Messages:
    87
    Chennai
    Fiat Enthusiast
    @Tornado Agree. Maruti will never take safety into consideration. Their sales numbers don't require them to do so as well. Not sure if they will be ethically obliged to the Indian consumer to produce cars with good safety ratings. Honda on the other hand brought in the Jazz through CKD route. Jazz had 5 star safety rating and it was the same Jazz that was sold worldwide. But Indian consumers being only price minded didn't show much interest in Jazz. 1st gen Jazz was a flop show and I believe the quality and safety of 1st gen Jazz was top notch. Globally 1st gen Jazz is still known for safety and quality. After seeing poor sales numbers for Jazz, Honda decided to go Maruti way. Honda is now driven only by sales numbers and mileage ratings. Flimsy door panels and sheet metals in cars to achieve mileage and low price. Budget cars ridicule safety. Fiat though can't match them in terms of sales numbers can atleast cater to enthusiasts like us. Slowly people will realize the value of Fiat. If in India manufacturers have scant regard for safety, then the Indian consumer with 'chalta hai' attitude is to be blamed first.
  9. prabhjot

    prabhjot Esperto

    Messages:
    2,449
    delhi ncr
    @ghodlur @Tornado

    I don't see what is not good about the Avventura's spare-wheel-mechanism design. There are many great cars from firms like Mercedes and VW, now Skoda and also Chevrolet in Brazil that had/have just such a mechanism.

    Why? (a) no tyre weight on hatch door i.e., no difficult/impossible-to-fix rattles on rear hatchdoor.
    (b) protection of the rear bumper retained
    (c) opening and esp closing the rear hatch is easier, since it is not as heavy as when the spare wheel is right on it, rather than on its own mechanism

    all obviously for (d) aesthetics, of a specific i.e., "butch" or "athletic" or "tough" sort.

    Now a 2 step opening procedure rather than 1, but so what, given the above? This is exactly like saying the Linea's 2-stage doors are so painfully heavy! to open and close, rather than the light and easy ones on say a City or Ciaz or Verna.

    But, I do hope the lock-jamming issue that Tornado and others have faced is only for the first batch of cars, and that the 2015 ones don't have any such. It appears like that is indeed the case, let's see.

    @acechip

    You really believe the Avventura has not been advertized enough? Sure, more is always better but I've seen full and half-page ads, including recently, the full TVC ( a really good one I felt, albeit arguably not 'desi' enough) and a clipped one too, including recently, a number of the youtube videos and automag reviews have been viewed tens of thousands of times, the Gauhar khan ones: lakhs of times, facebook and youtube testimonial videos etc as well, some offline city specific promotions too (eg Kanpur and Patna recently) etc.

    It, unlike the Linea or even the Evo, has indeed been well and successfully, some what, advertized. That the ad-s have failed to convert to sales beyond the 200-300 that you suspected was its fate from the very beginning...is ANOTHER matter. i.e., the utter lack of trust in the Fiat-brand and esp its dealers and ASS in the wider market, and the corresponding infinite faith in Hyundai, Suzuki etc, with Ford and renault (for now) somewhere in the middle.

    Can advertizing overcome this trust-gap/indifference and hostility even, towards the Fiat brand? I doubted it before the Avventura launched if you recall, and now am completely convinced that it will take very long and several other all-new launches before that eventuates for 'Fiat' in India. i.e., It will be expensive. i.e., FCA will likely focus TOTALLY on Jeep + only a t-jet here and an amt-option there for the Fiat cars, for the next 2 years?
    rj.031086 likes this.
  10. acechip

    acechip Superiore

    @prabhjot Sample this: a typical yuppy family contemplating their next new car. They look at the various "common" choices on the road and point out that they want something better, different, special:. more ground clearance for the Dad so he can take the family to their village. Solid build for the wife so she knows they and their kids are really "secure". And the kids would love to see their bikes carried on top of the roof. And Avventura can do it all, and more..and then they visit the showroom all the oohs and aahs follow and book a gorgeous Red/Orange one. In the process, the SA also tells them about the long service intervals and other such perks.

    They bring the car home. The neighbourhood uncle asks, "Yeh kaunsi gaadi hai bhai ? " And the other people mill around the car proclaiming " " Gorgeous/sexy" " Solid" , "hitech" "Sporty" and finally the Husband says with a smirk, " After all, Its a Fiat !"

    Some thing so-obvious must be told. Cant Fiat do this very "desi" style advertising ? Surely not beyond their means.

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