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FIAT to supply its multijet engines to Maruti, Now to Premier also

Discussion in 'Fiat India News' started by nkrishnap, Aug 18, 2011.


Should Fiat Supply its multijet engines to Maruti

  1. Yes

  2. No

  1. nkrishnap

    nkrishnap Staff Member Janitor

    Linea 1.3
    Guys just consider this. If TATA did not have access to the MJD, it would not have been in a position to even compare the Vista and Manza to Punto and Linea, it definitely would have reduced the inhouse competition.
  2. ramjn

    ramjn Staff Member Janitor

    Linea 1.3
    Maruti mulls making engines to meet diesel car demand
    Swaraj Baggonkar / Mumbai August 19, 2011, 0:49 IST

    The surge in diesel vehicle demand has prompted the company to explore options such as developing new engines as well as buying these from other companies.

    While diesel models constitute about 20-25 per cent of the total demand for Maruti Suzuki, its share has been on a surge over the past few months following a widened price gap between petrol and diesel.

    Maruti has thus asked its diesel engine and transmission-producing joint venture company, Suzuki Powertrain India, where Maruti holds 30 per cent equity stake, to double efforts to develop all-new a diesel engine range. Suzuki Powertrain India, which exports engines to Suzuki's European operation, had recently expanded its capacity by 25 per cent to 300,000 engines per annum.

    While demand for Maruti's diesel variant exists for eight of every 10 models, which otherwise is available in both fuel formats, the company is struggling to extend the diesel offering to more models.

    Maruti has strapped its only diesel engine, the 1.3 litre, built under technology licence agreement with Fiat and General Motors, onto four models — Ritz, Swift, Swift DZire and SX4. It is also considering buying engines and transmissions from Fiat India Automobiles, a joint venture company between Tata Motors and Fiat Group Automobiles S P A.

    On the option of buying engines from Fiat, Shinzo Nakanishi, managing director, Maruti Suzuki India, said, "That is one of the solutions. The engine is the same, but technically it is not easy as Fiat has tuned its engine differently than we have for ours. We have asked Suzuki Powertrain to develop new engines for us."

    "Since diesel pricing policy is not clear, we can not make huge investments to set up capacities. If we make investments tomorrow and the government changes the pricing of diesel and the diesel demand goes down, our investment will get nullified. Now our problem is when to make that decision,” said Nakanishi.

    Fiat's engine and transmission making factory at Ranjangaon near Pune, lies grossly under-utilised because of low offtake by both companies due to reduced demand. Fiat is planning to sell engines to other companies, including the 1.3 litre diesel engine to improve utilisation.

    Other companies such as General Motors and Ford Motor Company have, however, gone ahead and set up hybrid engine-making facilities in India which can build diesel and petrol on the same manufacturing line. Both General Motors and Ford, which are enlarging their diesel offering, can tune their engine type output according to the market demand.
  3. ramjn

    ramjn Staff Member Janitor

    Linea 1.3
    Maruti to source diesel engines from Fiat

    Maruti to source diesel engines from Fiat
    Press Trust of India / New Delhi August 19, 2011, 13:16 IST

    Car market leader Maruti Suzuki India today said it will source diesel engines from Fiat to meets its domestic requirement as it has decided not to make further big investments in powertrains in the absence of a fuel pricing policy.

    "Currently, we are exploring the possibility of sourcing diesel engines from somebody else, because making a big investment in expanding our own engine capacity is not prudent in this situation," Maruti Suzuki India Chairman R C Bhargava told reporters here on the sidelines of an IIFT event here.

    Asked specifically to confirm reports that MSI is sourcing diesel engines from Fiat, he replied in the affirmative.

    "Currently, we are in the process of homologation (of the diesel engine from Fiat)... It could take anywhere between two to three months...," Bhargava said.

    He, however, did not provide details of the diesel engines that MSI is looking to source from Fiat. At present, MSI manufactures and uses a 1.3-litre diesel engine for its Swift, DZiRE, Ritz and SX4 models under a licence from the Italian auto-maker.

    Bhargava said due to the huge price difference between petrol and diesel, the demand for diesel variants of models like SX4 and DZiRE has "suddenly shot up much more than what was forecast".Last week, Bhargava had ruled out making further substantial investments on expanding engine production in the absence of a clear roadmap on how the diesel prices would be in future.

    He had said MSI has been unable to decide on whether to invest on increasing diesel engine capacity or that of petrol engines.

    "We have a big problem in terms of absence of fuel (pricing) policy... While the demand for diesel has increased in the recent past due to the increased petrol price, I am not sure how long will this stay like that," he had said.

    Bhargava, however, said MSI is looking to enhance output at its existing facility at Manesar wherever possible.

    The company's diesel engine plant at Manesar currently produces 2.8 lakh engines per annum.

    Earlier this month, MSI had stated that it was drastically reducing exports of diesel engines to Hungary to cater to domestic demand.

    It exports about 35,000 to 45,000 units every year to Hungary, but is looking to reduce it to almost negligible levels in the next six months.
  4. Ravi

    Ravi Staff Member Janitor

    Grande Punto 1.3
    NDTV Profit is flashing this news and confirming it will be finalized in 2-3 months.

    Now I voted Yes, why because Maruti anyway using this engine. Now since FIAL is not able to use the potential of its plant. Selling the engine will give some financial help to JV. After all they are doing business.

    I don't see any harm.
    1 person likes this.
  5. gurjinder

    gurjinder Staff Member Janitor

    It's like giving a baseball bat to your enemy. So that he can beat us better.

    If only FIAT had the financial muscle to outlast the slump. And wring Maruti's neck by denying them any engines.

  6. That was a nice compilation about the used of fiat engine.
    I have voted yes to the poll. But fiat should insist on putting its logo on the engine at a prominent place and should not allow others to call it in what ever name they way for e.g., Suzuki calls its DDIS, Tata-Quadrajet.. By doing these things guess a lot of awareness could be created with the indian mass. Many of the car owners be it from suzuki or tata is not aware of the fact that they are running their car with a borrowed heart (engine).
  7. Cinju

    Cinju Esperto

    Even I voted YES. My point is
    1) Anyway this is going to increase the profit of FIAT which at this point of time is very necessary.
    2) More number of FIAT engines means more localisation. What I meant is when there are more & more FIAT engines, the FIAT MJD owners may get an alternate option to get their cars services rather than depending on TASS. Now the situation is the spares of Multijet engines are not available locally. I am talking about technicaly competent good local mechanics. Earlier there used to be Franchisee of TVS called MyTvs which services FIAT cars. They are more specialised in FIATS. Maybe we can go for such an option.
    3)If people get this feeling that even if they buy FIAT, they have alternate options to TASS I am sure many would opt for FIAT especially when the booking period of Maruti is so high.

    Above all FIAT should have their trademark logo on the engines supplied to Maruti. This is a must. It will be like a sheep's body with Lion's heart. :)
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2011
    1 person likes this.
  8. gurus

    gurus Amatore

    not sure about Tata has 50% ownership in the plant where engines are manufactured.
    Does this need approval from Tata since they are 50% owners of JV?
  9. drifter

    drifter Regolare

    It is general practise to use engines from other manufacturers,

    The BMW Mini used to use Chrysler petrol engines and Toyota Diesel engines. The second generation are PSA Diesel and petrol engines.

    Ford uses PSA engines. And so does Fiat. The Ford Galaxy was produced by Volkswagen and the Ford KA is produced by Fiat based on the Panda platform. The Fiat Scudo and the Fiat Ducato are produced by PSA with PSA engines that are re-badged as JTD engines for Fiat.

    The Smart uses in the 451 Mitsubishi engines. GM and Fiat till date ahre a development center for engines.

    Iveco supplies engines to Fiat too.

    And the list goes on.

    Fiat and PSA are both dependent on supplying engines to other manufacturers. All manufacturers are in some way dependent on others by platform sharing, engine sharing and even component sharing. There is no such thing as an individual car anymore.
  10. gurjinder

    gurjinder Staff Member Janitor

    You're right drifter babu , and it for sure is an age old practice.

    I am not challenging this aspect.

    I'm challenging this aspect because indirectly FIAT will be supplying engines to the cars which people will choose over FIATs themselves. Had FIAT been supplying the 1.3 MJD to a Maruti product priced in the 3-4 lakh or above 10lakh category then it would not have been an issue. This engine is gonna go into the Swift, which has now been positioned as a direct Punto rival ( according to Maruti :) ). So FIAT will be helping Swift's sales , which WILL hamper Punto sales even more.

    Had FIAT throttled Maruti's neck, it might've helped with the sales. But the finances are not permitting.

    I'm sure we'll be hard pressed to find an instance where a manufacturer supplies engines to a direct competitor in the global scenario.

    Here's an example from your home.

    Chrysler 300C Diesel uses the Mercedes V6 diesel.

    This engine is also found in the Mercedes C350CDI.

    Does this make sense? Yes. Because the 300C is priced 10,000 pounds lower than this C class. I hope you get my point.


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