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FIAT India Sales

Discussion in 'Fiat India News' started by amogh, Feb 5, 2015.

  1. i_mysterious1

    i_mysterious1 Novizio

    Messages:
    27
    Hyderabad
    Grande Punto 1.3 90 HP
    @prabhjot Though I agree that FIAT is definitely not doing well, I'm really skeptic about what happens to the market leaders soon after 2017 Safety rules come into vogue. Would FIAT be more successful if they made Safety of their vehicles a good campaign,also adding ABS and EBD and twin airbags as standard across all variants at a slight premium over the current price? Also, an Indian NCAP assessment of FIAT(which should be good) with widespread promotion just at the right time when other cars are found to have failed according to the 2017 rules,would that help?
    prabhjot likes this.
  2. Vidhyashankar Kannan

    Vidhyashankar Kannan Regolare

    Messages:
    271
    Hyderabad
    Hyderabad
    Avventura 1.3 90 HP
    I'm afraid the Indian markets and governance are still far away from actually favouring Fiat's safety. The VW emission scandal has not even tickled the Indian market. VW cars continue to sell here better than before. After the scandal broke out, there were some half-hearted statements from the govt saying that they will also look into it. But road tax money is much more important than eveything else. If tin can Altos sell the highest in India inspite of everyone knowing how weak they are, there is zero importance being placed on Fiat's safety.

    Besides, the huge sales of the publicly accepted overpriced Creta only shows that people have the money and will spend on a brand that is perceived to be premium. So come 2017, in all likelihood, Maruti and Hyundai will make their cars a little more safer and lot more expensive. People will go and buy them saying that they are safer and have better service than Fiat. The Tiago is not seeing crazy sales like it should over the i10. The Indian perception is screwed up quite badly beyond a point of return.

    the i10 has failed the NCAP norms quite poorly. And it was India's Car of the Year. That says it all when it come to safety
  3. i_mysterious1

    i_mysterious1 Novizio

    Messages:
    27
    Hyderabad
    Grande Punto 1.3 90 HP
    http://m.autocarindia.com/Article.aspx?CIID=401329&type=News
    Found this baby FIAT on autocar. With the right combi of Service outlets + Brand Building+ Mileage and the eco friendly tax benefits from the govt, this baby might just eat into a share of the Renault Kwid's pie in India.
    But, Duster set the stage for a big investment in the form of Kwid from Renault. FIAT,unfortunately doesn't have a current decent seller to build its brand.
    Nevertheless, its worth a try. If the car does fail in India,they still have export options to other south Asian countries considering the cheap making costs in India. A case in point-MSIL exporting India made Baleno to Japan.
  4. kk27

    kk27 Amatore

    Messages:
    202
    Kandivali - Mumbai
    Kandivali - Mumbai
    Fiat Enthusiast
    Fiat will only launch new vehicles in India which will be export oriented. period.

    Only good thing we should be happy about is Engine sales are gonna increase dramatically & so will transmission. Which means FIAT will be here to stay with few models here & there. And we have 99rpm for spares. I honestly care less of how FIAT is perceived in this market.

    I care lesser of how I & my status gets perceived when I come in a Palio (that's what cars are for in this country - status symbol). So while I may be perceived as "A Poor man, with little or no money, equally poor on judgement by having a Fiat, and probably no sense of self-image driving a 10yr old Palio". But what they don't know is I never have to really search for my car in a Mall parking and if nothing else I'll still buy a Fiat for this uniqueness. What good is a FIAT if it becomes a Maruti!
  5. Raj_pol

    Raj_pol Regolare

    Messages:
    495
    Bangalore
    Punto Evo 1.3
    @prabhjot Most of what you have said is false but there is no use arguing. I might as well argue with Arundhati Roy that Maoist's are not Gandhian's with guns.

    The most glaring being - most of the TSI owner's go for it because of the automatic. Ease of driving in the city and the thrill outside. Of course you will not mention the gearbox which is so bad that even with 30+ horses more the Abarth is maybe just a second faster to the ton.

    Also the fact that I had already said last year that the Kwid has a high probability of being successful and now that it is - you put it in a different class and make excuses for it. The same for Mahindra - they have got the hang of the market and ugly or not the KUV and TUV will sell.

    Who the hell looks at digital advertisement's when buying car's? 90% of India does not. If FIAT does not understand the simple fact they are not qualified to sell car's.
    jackharrisw, vista7155 and gpunto75 like this.
  6. SwifttoPunto

    SwifttoPunto Novizio

    Messages:
    47
    Bangalore
    Punto Evo 1.3 90 HP
    Specifically on Punto Abarth, even though everyone is comparing it with Polo TSI, I am sure there are quite number of enthusiasts who would have bought S Cross 1.6 instead of Punto. When S Cross 1.6 was launched at higher price who except driving enthusiasts would have bought those. Now after price revision it is much more attractive. They may already been planning for a remap and extract much more power down the line. It has everything to go for all round disc brake, good gear box, good driveability, handling, etc.
    At price band lower than that people would have lot more considerations while buying a vehicle not just power.
    But I guess even Fiat was aware that there will not be many takers and hence, their plan I guess was 50 units per month. When I had changed my booking from Abarth to Punto 90hp I had asked SA about how many bookings they have. He had told they have bookings and on an average they would be planning to sell 50 cars per month. I was surprised to hear that thinking he was referring to sales through his dealership alone. But I realised now the he was referring to Fiat India level. So that plan was realistic. But bad thing is even that they could not achieve.
    I am sure there are many more people who are hesitant to go for Punto Abarth due to doubt over Fiat's future plan also. Unlike MJD this TJET engine is specific to Fiat and have to depend on them. There may be other sources like 99rpm, but is can not be a match having dealers and Company.
    prabhjot likes this.
  7. Raj_pol

    Raj_pol Regolare

    Messages:
    495
    Bangalore
    Punto Evo 1.3
  8. i_mysterious1

    i_mysterious1 Novizio

    Messages:
    27
    Hyderabad
    Grande Punto 1.3 90 HP
    @SwifttoPunto , Right on mate! The big tragedy is that FIAT shoot itself in the foot by giving 1.6 MJD to MSIL. A lot of new buyers would be interested had it been on the Linea!
  9. prabhjot

    prabhjot Esperto

    Messages:
    2,446
    delhi ncr
    Folks buy the tsi and 'gt' tdi mostly for the automatic, NOT because of its hot-hatch-ness. THAT was the point: there are next-to-no sporty/driving-centric customers in india.

    It IS true that the tsi dsg + get tdi sell at 12-15% of total Polo sales, so yes the evidence is very emphatic that there is NO market for sporty/fast hatch/sedan-ness (handling etc) in India.

    A hot hatch cannot have a a dsg outobox being the source of the 'purported' hotness. So no, your point's invalid: still no evidence of their being a meaningful number of 'driving enthusiast' buyers in india.

    I have explained this to you before: Renault succeeding with the KWID has exactly zero essons for Fiat. A Fiat KWID would not have sold much at all. Besides, FIAT under Marchionne does NOT do market-building at losses of thousands of crores like Carlos Ghosn and Renault-Nissan. This 'loss-leader', try 6-7 models for one 'hit' at a time approach, is worthless and plain foolish.

    Likewise with an automatic. Say Fiat had launched the amt it is supplying to Maruti and Tata first on the Punto and Avventura. Would that have made a meaningful difference to sales? Or say the ddct is launched on the Linea and the Abarth: will we see sales rise say even 50% off the current abysmally-low base?

    A Fiat- and not Mahindra-branded KUV100 would sell even 500, you think? Come on.

    Besides: FIAT does not make dinky, flake-y totally third-world-specialised, super-cut-price Nano-type cars (kwid), period. Even the new MOBI in brazil is bigger, heavier, bigger-engined, wider-tyred, etc etc. Or Mahindra-style jugaad-engineering cars. Not that GM, Ford, VW, Toyota do either!

    It is a brand and automotive consumer-culture thing/problem for Fiat, NOT a product or spec or engine or feature one!

    There is NO demand (beyond at best IMO say 1200, maybe 1500 in all at the very best) for a Fiat, new or old, automatic+marketing or not.

    They HAVE run many marketing campaigns over the last year and a half: from facebook and youtube to tv to print ads. It has had no sales effect whatsoever.

    As a marketing guy: you surely realize, right?, that that is a sign of a written-off/stigmatised brand, don't you?

    The/your idea that new models+automatic and advertzingx5 or x10 (costing thousands of crores in total investment) will yield any, even-remote chance of a payoff is touching in its faith, on Fiat's behalf, in the wisdom and openeness of the indian car market/buyer.

    BUT: it is false.

    The kwid and kuv100 are first-movers. Hence their apparent success. EVEN if Fiat would allow itself making such compromised, brand-disloyal and brand-values-violating models.....it is by definition too late already. The malai makhan, such as it is (remember sales numbers have little correlation to profitability, the kwid is not for making-any-money for many a year) belongs to the first-mover alone. Fiat tried being an early-mover with the Avventura: flop. They've tried being a fist-mover with Abarth: flop.

    Witness the fate of the duster once maruti+hyundai entered the segment. Now watch how the ecosport sinks, at least if left un-heavily-discounted, as Maruti Vitara B + the upcoming Hyundai +Tata + Mahindra enter and rampup.
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2016
  10. Raj_pol

    Raj_pol Regolare

    Messages:
    495
    Bangalore
    Punto Evo 1.3
    @prabhjot I can dig up my earlier emails but I had mentioned many months before the release of the Abarth that 100 is the best it can do. A lot of TV ad's plus the availability in smaller towns can still take it to around 100.

    In my world mind you Facebook and you tube does not count. Car buyers in India would still prefer hoardings, paid magazine ads and TV.

    Anyways, I agree Fiat or VW does not have the capacity in India to open a new segment that too which is very niche like a premium hot hatchback. So the volumes do not lie here.

    What I have been always arguing is how to get volumes in India and they simply cannot do it with 7 year old cars. See, the first thing that a viewer notices is how the car looks. That is why folks take snaps with a Ferrari and not a Swift. The Avventura, the old Punto, the new Punto and the Abarth all look the same. So to an end user they are the same cars whatever be the changes inside.

    For a company to make inroads it has to start somewhere, Hyundai did not start at number 2 in India - it took time and perseverance along with understanding the customer and genuine effort. Fiat for all the technology it has never made an honest effort after the Palio days.

    It has a small opportunity with the Jeeps but they are going to screw that up too by bringing in CBU's which will be insanely priced thus putting off customers. if they have waited so long, they should wait some more and launch a vehicle at the sweet spot of 10 L to 18 L, bang against the Creta and beating the same in every area starting with yes the rear view camera's and the seats and the music system etc to the engine. Also, there must be absolutely no freaking resemblance with the Punto or Palio or any existing Fiat car. Trying to sell Jeeps at 80 L - well it is going to be a disaster and they might as well not try.
    i_mysterious1 and prabhjot like this.

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