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FIAT India Sales

Discussion in 'Fiat India News' started by amogh, Feb 5, 2015.

  1. Vidhyashankar Kannan

    Vidhyashankar Kannan Regolare

    Messages:
    271
    Hyderabad
    Hyderabad
    Avventura 1.3 90 HP
    It's around 676 this month. Lower than last month. The SCross would have surely taken away a few Fiat customers as it garnered good reviews on the build quality, ride, steering and handling front. It's only going to get harder for Fiat to sell.
    PradeepM likes this.
  2. Sujit508

    Sujit508 Amatore

    Messages:
    233
    Bangalore , Karnataka
    Bangalore
    Retro / Classic FIAT
    Hoping that the New Abarth Punto could bring in 200-300 units of sales per month. Timing and Marketing are the key factors. lets see.
  3. Vidhyashankar Kannan

    Vidhyashankar Kannan Regolare

    Messages:
    271
    Hyderabad
    Hyderabad
    Avventura 1.3 90 HP
    200 units per month may happen, but surely only after cannibalizing other Fiats. The fact that SCross has sold about 4600 units and Creta about 7000 in August shows that people have money to blow on overpriced cars. It is the herd mindset and erroneous perception of what are good brands and what are good products. M and H have it bang on. I have seen a Creta loaded with 5 people and the rear suspensions have sunk all the way down. I can only imagine the wheelie that the car must be doing. Yet, they sell.

    The only way Fiats will now sell are maybe if safety ratings are made compulsory. Or maybe something drastic happens to break the mindset (impossible). Or they bring in another car like the Kwid to start at ground level. Or they move to the upper segment entirely. Or keep very few FASS around in Tier 1 cities. After all, an average of 700 cars a month is 8400 cars per annum. In 3 years time, they will need ongoing servicing and FASS can make money.
    PradeepM and prabhjot like this.
  4. Sujit508

    Sujit508 Amatore

    Messages:
    233
    Bangalore , Karnataka
    Bangalore
    Retro / Classic FIAT
    Non VFM seems to be the mantra in India nowadays. H & M launched their cars with a Top end model whose pricing was very premium. Creta & S-Cross onroad at 17+. But also have a small displacement unit at around 12L . which is where the bulk of the sales happens.

    It seems to be a image booster in India, Where the aam junta thinks , all creta owners have spent 17+ lacs. But 90% of them have just spent around 12.

    Fiat could have adopted the same stragery for 1.6 Linea alongside the 1.3.
  5. prabhjot

    prabhjot Esperto

    Messages:
    2,450
    delhi ncr
    One can be assured of some decently energetic marketing competence from Kevin Flynn. Let's see what the new upcoming adv campaign's like? As he said, 2016 is a big year as far as FCA's concerned but only because of the AutoExpo and the JEEP brand and new-dealer-launch. It is in 2017 that the all-new JEEP as well as FIAT models arrive. They might do, say, an Abarth Linea in the meanwhile?

    He is on the job also when it comes to a 'supportive relationship' with the dealers goes, perhaps monthly sales including Abarth of say 900+ a month, the odd redundant dealer (eg., in Delhi ncr) culled....and the FASS operations will be mostly profitable enough, in any case?
  6. opendro

    opendro Timido

    Messages:
    22
    Bangalore
    It Linea had 1.6, that would have outsold the 1.3, because Linea deserves it more than any other car and most of us know that. FIAT was trying to beat in price instead of beating in an overall package. I still enjoy the Linea 1.3 but I really miss some extra horse power there. I hope Punto Abarth see at least four digit. But the real game changer will be from diesels, not petrols.

    You cannot blame the mass. FIAT has to take some of the blame. They gave beautiful looking cars with super ride and handling. But failed to provide with a competent engine (performance and mileage if not refinement), gearbox and interior. I cannot even keep a 700 ml water bottle in my Linea. Ergonomics are worst. AC is very poor and inadequate. They didn't even bother to change all the cars with the buggy seat height adjustment. They replaced only for those who complained. Mud guards and floor mats were not even available for a long time. Many accessories were fragile - vanity mirrors, glove box locking, arm rest box lock, etc. I had the rubber seal between the windshield and bonnet torn or hanging loose from day 1 and there is nothing I can do to keep it snug. List will go on. Even the brake is inadequate. It brakes adequately but with a lot of black dust and compromise on the pad life. A bigger disc would have done well.

    Last edited: Sep 4, 2015
    PradeepM likes this.
  7. Bharath Balasubramanian

    Bharath Balasubramanian Timido

    Messages:
    23
    Hyderabad
    Fiat Enthusiast
    Hello All,

    I am Bharath and am new here though have been following all the conversations pretty much on a daily basis. I drive a polo but do appreciate the Puntos and Lineas a lot. I hope we do get a Linea Abarthified in a year or so...
    prabhjot likes this.
  8. prabhjot

    prabhjot Esperto

    Messages:
    2,450
    delhi ncr
    @opendro

    You have an early,pre-2012 Linea, perhaps from 2009 or 2010? My dad had one too: it had several initial niggles ALL minor imo, except for the clutch slave cylinder issue which was replaced for everyone under warranty. After the initial niggles were sorted out, in his case: beautiful bullet proof everything.

    I do doubt that the sales dip in the Linea had anything to do with 'underpowered', no bottle holders etc. It was the weak sales channel (Tata), the patchy/uneven ASS channel (Tata), the spare parts availability in those initial years via TASS, all in the context of a market that already harboured very widespread distrust of Fiat in particular and European marques in general (given expeciences in the Uno and Palio days).

    So while one could certainly say they've been to blame.....that's really a pretty old story now, true really only pre-2012, maybe even pre-Tata/TASS days (since our experience with TASS was always par-for-the-course).

    The REAL question is this: why no responsiveness by the marketplace to (a) the on average much improved ASS work and especially spares availiability, pricing and quality, also of warranty support (b) the excellent facelifts and improvements including on the minor stuff that counts disproportionately in India (i.e., everything but build, ride, handling, steering, braking, engine characteristsics etc). If my ownership of the Linea t-jet since May last year is any indicator the new Punto-s and Linea-s and Avventura-s are just downright superbly put-together EVEN for the small things, and big improvements on the pre-facelift avatars of these cars (c) the greater marketing, including several ad campaigns from 'Make the Move' to the Avventura launch one and several others (e.g., Hello Life etc) in between.

    Clearly everyhting is better from Fiat's end, on what are already in most ways class-best vehicles, including pricing+warranties+CofO.....but either

    (a) the scale has to be three or five times greater (number of all-new models, marketing, dealer process quality) OR

    (b) competing in these segments at these price points in a Jap+Korean dominated market culture (for scooters, bikes AND cars)---- to the tune of 80% of sales, is the REAL issue, namely near-impossible, profitably, that is.

    Mefeels (b) is true and so they need to ride the market upwards (it's moved up into the 12-16 lakh range: big sales numbers at those prices nowadays) with their more 'premium-within-mass' models (e.g., 500X, 500L, Aegea sedan and cross(over)-hatch, etc) rather than with mass market price competitive replacements for the Punto or even the Linea at 7-12lakhs.

    Also, or rather first and foremost: EXPORTS.

    I just read in the excellent current print issue of Autocar, for eg: an interview with Kevin Flynn by Hormadz Sorabji, where he reiterates the importance of supporting the dealers and creating better financial-health for them, and......drops a very very strong hint about the 2017 arrival of the Aegea sedan+ (i am guessing) the Aegea hatch-as-a-crossover?. He names the Aegea in an answer, it was not put into his mouth! 2017, then, and....meanwhile Abarth+the JEEP launch, including Autocar claims a very likely Linea-spicing-up ABARTH-version at 145hp.

    PS: the stuff Tata are doing to re-birth themselves further, after the excellent Bolt and Zest, is awesome, if Autocar's initial review of the HEXA is anything to go by: a knock-out vehicle, truly.

    This then is what FIAT needs to do, one feels: leave the mass-market or Indian-market-special products to Tata, and focus on their pukka Italian/European and American models (Abarth-s, 500X, bigger-- New-- Avventura, Aegeax3, JEEPs, etc)
  9. Raj_pol

    Raj_pol Regolare

    Messages:
    497
    Bangalore
    Punto Evo 1.3
    @prabhjot After having read reviews, seen pictures and all, I feel the Jeep renegade has a bigger market in India than the 500X. IMHO, I feel the push should be in the 10L to 25L market where there is still space for competition before Hyundai loads with the Creta's and FIAT loses that marketplace also.
    Indians love butch looks and cute looks are not going to do well - hence I never understood the efforts spent behind getting the Abarth brand in India. The same amount should have been spent in the T-jet Punto and all new cars. As I keep saying a showroom should have at the least 5 different looking cars for the crowd to get inside and look. Ideally, a volume car, a hatchback, a sedan, a crossover and an SUV is the minimum required in the portfolio.
  10. prabhjot

    prabhjot Esperto

    Messages:
    2,450
    delhi ncr
    @Raj_pol

    The trick though is to achieve enough sharing of platform, powertrains and as many other modules and sub-assemblies as possiblie across the different offerings, which is ONLY possible via export volumes.

    Sales volumes for the FIAT brand or indeed even the higher-priced JEEP brand in India do not otherwise make any made-in/for-India models either practical or prudent.

    The great thing is thet the JEEP c-suv shares most things with a number of other models from the Aegea sedan+hatch/cross+sw....to the Renegade, the 500X, the sub-Renegade small sporty JEEP shown recently to US FCA dealers, the upcoming 5-door Fiat 500. And the India-only 'New Avventura' too?

    So yeah, if they have enough export volumes of even engines and transmissions and many/most other modules, let alone for rhd drive fully-built cars/suv-s, or even for some lhd exports......it seems they can, by end-2017+2018+onwards:

    Offer C+/D1/evenD2-segment large spacious vehicles that meet their global engineering and build standards, while keeping costs and prices down enough to compete against the Japanese and Korean firms that cut-costs and profit in other, less palatable ways (compromised engineering+build+safety).

    All such strategic product-planning decisions must happen now or very soon (lead time of 1.5/2 years is needed). The question is: should they persist with the Brazilian lower-cost, new Palio-platform-based models (new 6/7 to 10/12 lakh rupee models), strategically, or whether the potential volumes at prices upwards of 10/12 lakhs plus of course exports make the Duster+XUV+Creta+SCross, and upwards somewhat, price-segment THE segment they must bet on for India?

    One does sense that models like the C-Suv+Renegade+500X+Aegea sedan/hatch(cross)+sub-Renegade small JEEP+New Avventura will fit the bill, market potential as well as export+costing-wise, given the shared platform, architectures and powertrains? Kevin Flynn seems to hint that they might well be betting big on the SUSW platform these cars are on, rather than on the new Brazilian Palio-based-one.

    EVEN better if they manage to place some of these bigger, SUSW platform models onto the new Palio platform somehow without too much of a compromise in ride, handling etc, just like they did for the Indian Linea and Punto relative to the latter's European mates, as a keep the cost-and-price-down engineering strategy.

    And so the more mass, sub-10-lakh market must by 2018 be quit-from! Leave that to Tata via the JV, the engines etc. Except for the Abarth t-jet Punto+Avventura+Linea(?!), of course.

    How they ensure the number of dealers and each dealer's turnover is decent-enough till the 2017 all-new localized Fiats and JEEP arrive in 2017, and 2018, is THE challenge they seem to be addressing front-on under Kevin Flynn, as he has stated as much in several frank interviews.

    As a filler for the Fiat and Abarth brand and mainly for the dealers, mefeels they really must do an interim-model beyond the Abarth Punto, Avventura and possibly, Linea, and also do a CKD with the India-made t-jet engine etc of the coming-soon Mazda-built Fiat 124 Spider. It is a truly singular, very charismatic vehicle, and may well be cheap-enough to offer CKD in India with good rather than just token sales figures.

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