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FIAT India Sales

Discussion in 'Fiat India News' started by amogh, Feb 5, 2015.

  1. Raj_pol

    Raj_pol Regolare

    Messages:
    495
    Bangalore
    Punto Evo 1.3
    The Lodgy is an interesting find - has done better than the Duster this month. I was with a friend of mine today - he was receiving his Honda City and was very happy with the car. I was impressed by the dashboard and the console. Fantastically intuitive and easy - I remember last year posting in the community as I was unable to understand some of the options for the Punto.

    I personally have nothing against the shape - there are folks who hate the same, but I am okay with it.

    Fiat - Ah, the day they do a global launch here (which is launching a vehicle in India at the same time they launch around the world will be the day their fortunes change). For now we will hopefully be seeing the consistent numbers throughout the year.
  2. SOOZ_P

    SOOZ_P Regolare

    Messages:
    316
    BANGALORE
    Bangalore
    Grande Punto 1.3
    737. Ok, again this is a consistency that fiat is maintaining. With the brand image they have in India, product portfolio and network (only considering the place where they get respect, may be 10 places in India), this number is still decent to keep them moving. They too know that they have to start from clean slate. Until 2017, if they keep themselves under talks in industry, bring new products for common people and few luxury cars for upper class, they can bounce back in India.
    Anyhow their plans for india definitely brings assurance to me to drive and enjoy My FIAT.
    prabhjot likes this.
  3. prabhjot

    prabhjot Esperto

    Messages:
    2,446
    delhi ncr
    @Raj_pol

    The sales figures for Fiat don't bear any further comment, since we've all done that to death and back, several times over.

    BUT: (a) the puny sales for the truly brilliant all-round (design, equipment AND engineering+marketing+new improved dealers, TASS) effort by Tata with the Zest and Bolt is a sign of large scale market-structure change, namely that the Jap+Koreans are STRUCTURALLY at a huge huge advantage (almost 'oligopolistic' though more like 'oligopolistic competition'), one that is easy to cope with profits-wise only if.....

    (b) the particualar car model has a very unique selling point, of which the Duster is the best example. Unknown and uncared for brand, yet the car sold well. BUT: come the Lodgy and it promptly cannibalizes Duster sales hugely, and in any case the Japs and the Korean are coming soon with their Duster-killers. Not to mention Mahindra's being by the marketplace credited with improving their game.

    Its death as a sales success and that of the Ecosport too is imminent, betraying the medium- let alone long-run futility of trying to go up against the dominant Japs + Hyundai BRANDS with nothing more than particularly market-demand-apt individual models. This model by Ford and Renault-Nissan (never more than one good-selling model, which fades badly within 2-3 years) is guaranteed to lose barrels of money endlessly, which is precisely what it has done for them in India hitherto.

    Tata Motors (in which one way or another Fiat has a 'stake') in India is the fascinating case currently of a, I'd say the ONLY company with the means and apparently the longterm commitment to break-up the cosy, almost guaranteed oligopoly-domination by the Jap+the Korean firms. Fiat's India revenue and profit fortunes ride more on them than on Fiat or Jeep itself.

    Now if Tata can make a better fist of selling the upcoming for 2017 2 all-new (similarly timed as the india-made jeep) SUVs with the 1.5 and the 2litre mjd, plus the small SUV Nexon with the 1.3 mjd, not to mention the amt sales and the JV's manufacturing profits.....FCA in India is on a firm footing financially in India for the longterm. Esp since Maruti needs those engines and that amt too in greater numbers for the next many years, even pending a bigger global tie-up between Suzuki and FCA.

    PS: Now, FCA India, when is the t-jet Avventura coming? And the Abarth Punto? Hurry up now! Jaldi karo, na?! :p
  4. Raj_pol

    Raj_pol Regolare

    Messages:
    495
    Bangalore
    Punto Evo 1.3
    @prabhjot The Bolt would not sell even if it had a V6 engine for the same price - reason it looks like the Tata Indica and nobody in India including me likes to be called a taxi driver.

    Tata keeps on making marketing blunders and then complaining about low sales would not work. Hyundai is going to release the Creta soon. Just watch the styling - does not matter if it is stolen from an European manufacturer it will sell.

    And the T-jet, what the hell is there to test? Release it man by June end or July and be done with it. Avventura was delayed by so many months and at the end of the day they forgot the top end Petrol :p
    vista7155 likes this.
  5. prabhjot

    prabhjot Esperto

    Messages:
    2,446
    delhi ncr
    @Raj_pol

    The t-jet is being tested endlessly, i think, because this t-jet is NOT the t-jet on the Linea. It is a much more heavily localized and/or retuned/designed one (possibly a 1.2 litre version? different turbo plumbing?).

    Why are they doing that? To meet price targets, of course.

    Why do they have to do that? Because we are a diesel-biased market where almost nobody in the mass market buys petrol cars unless they are much cheaper than equivalent diesels, and unless they're hyper-fuel efficient.

    It's simple, really, you ought to know that since you're a self-professed member of the ruling AAM AADMI party in the Indian car market.;)

    However, your sarcasm's well-justified in that champion engine+killer prices will make little difference to sales.

    Why? Because it's not the car, its engines and styling that sells: they're all distantly way down the prority list for 90%+ buyers. It is the BRAND in the abstract terms of trust, ass quality assurance and resale value first and vague prestige and 'looks' second only then followed by a myriad other considerations, the least of which are engines and gearbox shift quality, ride handling, safety, build etc.

    Fiat's better off dialing back, gradually, on the mass market altogether (reducing the no. of dealers etc) because there's little chance of sales growing, this year or for 5 years, even after all-new Hyundai-style Fiats are launched, as you advocate. And focus almost totally, gradually, instead, on jeep, abarth, alfa, maserati and ferrari, while they continue to profit from this impossibly difficult mass marketplace via Maruti, Suzuki? and Tata. They are, remember, the ONLY profitable car firm here other than Maruti, Hyundai and Mahindra.

    So, contrary to what almost everyone thinks, FCA in India is the car firm with the third most 'correct' approach and strategy in India, not the last.

    Of course, they won't do what am advocating: the all-new Punto+Avventura+Grand Sienna will come, as will the 1.5 mjd, eventually. Instead, they'll keep plodding on, profitably though, and probably become strongly export centric even with those models, let alone the localized small Jeep(s).

    They're BOTH too optimistic AND not-too-but-very cautious/timid/pessimistic about the Indian mass market's profitable possibilities for the 'Fiat' brand.

    Just the right approach, imo, look at their profits, a rare thing in the Indian car baazar?!:p

    And they haven't even started exporting (they will, starting with the Jeep c-suv) which is the only reason so far VW, Nissan, Renault and Ford (very hyperactive exporters) have maintained a minimal (unprofitable) sustainability in India.
  6. multijetter

    multijetter Regolare

    Messages:
    277
    Mumbai
    Fiat car are not there in the list

    Top-10-Least-Selling-Cars-In-India.jpg
    Ichimaru and prabhjot like this.
  7. Raj_pol

    Raj_pol Regolare

    Messages:
    495
    Bangalore
    Punto Evo 1.3
    @prabhjot Prof...One of your theories may be just facing a massive roadblock. The VW Polo for this month has inched into the top 20 cars sold for the month list. Early days but if they can maintain for a few months I will be happy and will also prove that the Aam Aadmi (moi included) are not as dumb as you say so. Of course they have basic safety (airbags) in all versions, they have the petrol, the diesel, the sports petrol and the sports diesel.

    Again, you will observe like they always do - Fiat is concentrating on a T-jet but no equivalent sports diesel so their marketing is already off. As I keep telling sooner or later marketing push and smart tactics will show an impact. A member of the horse forum was telling how some of his younger relatives would not be seen dead in a Swift because it is not cool. The Polo is the cool, german dude with the required power. The Hyundai is the flashy dude with all the bling. That leaves the Punto no where. Our current generation does not care about so called ageless looks and instead prefer angular, sharp or muscular designs. So, give it to them.

    (Do not mention a discourse on the 3 pot. It is the marketing that counts. For all the torque that it offers no one in my office and I mean no one has heard about the T-jet. Everybody know about the ivtec).

    As a comparison look at the Ducati or the MV Augusta. They are Italian brands and whether they do well or not they have a legendary reputation and story behind them - unlike Fiat.
    JohnyBoy and dadasaheb like this.
  8. dadasaheb

    dadasaheb Regolare

    Messages:
    374
    Pune
    MH 12 (Ranjangaon)
    Linea 1.3
    3k more polo sold than all 4-5 Fiats, with the same exterior looks from launch time with some cosmetic changes here and there.
    reasons - all engine options are available along with the GT TSI automatic.
  9. prabhjot

    prabhjot Esperto

    Messages:
    2,446
    delhi ncr
    @Raj_pol

    Wrong, mostly.

    The vast majority of Polo-s are of the 3 pot petrol and the diesel, not the TSi, GT. So no, this sales figure even if not a one-off blip, says nothing about our market's interest in engines or any sophisticated car-sense.

    The Polo's numbers have probably just shot up because of inventory buildup, since the pre-facelift Vento's production has stopped several months ago.

    It is even this exceptional? month well down on its numbers from 2 years ago. And more importantly this market segment has grown in size, so its marketshare is still puny. Wait till the jazz and the maruti 'premium big' hatch launch, very soon.

    That the Indian-spec VW is regarded as a 'premium german' or whatever is funny, since it is neither premium nor particularly german (design? build? ride? tyre? steering? clutch? brakes? nvh-diesel? equipment). I've personally seen a UK Polo, and driven a Golf there: this Indian version car is very diluted.

    Funny or not, VW in India has no lessons for Fiat.

    It is a hugely loss making company here, with little negative brand legacy or history, in fact many folks as you point out regard it as 'premium', and with gigantic advertizing budgets, that FCA India just cannot afford. Still, it loses money in India. Its sales are down a lot from a year and a half ago.

    Those friends of yours wouldn't buy a Fiat EVEN though/if it simply is better than the Polo+Vento (version-for-version, rupee-for-rupee) on pretty much every parameter, including both the 1.2 and the 1.4 fire and even the mjd (except for low gear torque).

    The brands are of completely different character, and even VW has faced nothing but failure coping with the Japanese and Korean dominance here, despite the huge ad-spends, the dsg and what not.

    btw, the next-gen Polo and Vento are at least 2 years away: tells you something.

    You are mistaken about Fiat's history: sales and profits have sometimes been huge, often not. But the brand, a maker of small economical affordable cars all its life, has many design and engineering 'trophies' in its cabinet, over many decades.

    Its history in India is splendid: other than its (after)sales troubles, admittedly self-inflicted?

    The Punto and Avventura are still, it is very difficult to argue otherwise, (among) the very best designed, inside or out, cars in India in these segments.

    So if engines are of little potential for Fiat sales, and if what you say is right, then Fiat-design is no use either.......?!

    BUT, like your error-prone friends, no-one other than some us owners, cares, so no financial point trying to persuade this marketplace imo.

    Better to keep steadily and increasingly milking it financially via Tata and Maruti, and ignore 'Fiat' (for now, for a year or two, at least) in favour of Jeep+exports.

    After all if your friends won't touch a Fiat, and they're the less conservative ones, you say....?
    Last edited: Jun 9, 2015
    Ichimaru likes this.
  10. dadasaheb

    dadasaheb Regolare

    Messages:
    374
    Pune
    MH 12 (Ranjangaon)
    Linea 1.3
    Last edited: Jun 9, 2015
    multijetter, Raj_pol and prabhjot like this.

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