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Fiat India - Sales Thread (2014)

Discussion in 'Fiat India News' started by Ravi, Feb 12, 2014.

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  1. Saket Sidana

    Saket Sidana Regolare

    Messages:
    491
    Delhi NCR
    Linea T-Jet
    Dec 2014: Linea did well by selling out 313 [144 in Nov], mainly due to whopping discounts. Evo and Avventura pretty low numbers at 490[616 in Nov]. They need to do better, aren't selling even 1000 per month.
  2. jackharrisw

    jackharrisw Amatore

    Messages:
    146
    Chennai
    In my case it's not me advertising my car(Punto). Whenever any friends or relatives travel in my car, the car itself is able to impress them and make them yell ' This car is good, I didn't know this earlier, I made a mistake by not test driving this car the time when we bought our new car'
    prabhjot likes this.
  3. vista7155

    vista7155 Regolare

    Messages:
    305
    bangalore
    Slightly OT but i thought of sharing it here because it also influence the buyers.
    @mods if this post is not appropriate in this thread please move it.
    If I remember correctly here somebody was talking about long service intervals,less maintenance compared to competation but as i gone through this below case in Team-bhp http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/technical-stuff/156372-fiat-punto-engine-failure-57000-kms.html
    I am really sad how they washed their hands blaming the customer,where the said part is no where related to the nature of failure.
    I love the way the car drives and rides.That said, I am worried when I hear such instances. My intention was to keep the car for long and while upgrading, upgrade to another from Fiat stable i am not sure about that.
    From now on i will be more alert to check the engine oil level after very service done from famous FASS.And i strongly think that we should change the engine oil every 7-8k kms and filter change because of bad city traffic and very dusty environment.
    As very famous phrase tells Precaution is better then cure.
  4. asimpleson

    asimpleson Esperto

    Messages:
    2,998
    Heptanesia
    Linea 1.3
    @vista7155, The issue of low oil and timing chain replacement are being mixed up in that thread. I cannot blame the guy there for timing chain not changed esp. at 55k odd kms, however, the oil level was down to critically dangerous levels and even 1500kms drive is more that enough to eat up the internals of engine; any engine let alone Fiat. Also problem with timing chain even if attributed to his negligence by many should have stalled the engine as soon as chain snapped and should have limited damage to head components, the rocker arms, valves and all. The pistons too do not suffer major damage I gather from discussions with FASC as is what usually happens to MJD. The whole thing shouts of negligence or bad luck about oil change or oil leak at some point.

    What you say is correct, if you use say a semi-synth oil like 10W40 and change at 5-6k or latest at 7.5kms along with filter we can ensure a healthy engine and even a healthy turbo charger. Of-course turbo needs that idling before stopping after runs to prevent coking.
  5. prabhjot

    prabhjot Esperto

    Messages:
    2,443
    delhi ncr
    @vista7155

    Well, you are free to doubt the by-far most reliable diesel engine in the country running perfectly well in, I'd say, an extremely impressive % of cases in Fiats, Maruti-s and Tata-s! Where is the evidence in that thread that Fiat or FASS is in any way responsible for his woes?

    Every other ignorant/negligent car-owner has taken to abusing the nature of (mal)information on the internet by ranting against this firm or that, with companies with unremarkable reliability and service (all-told, including cost) like Honda, Hyundai and Maruti getting away lightly of course, while the Fiats, VW-s, Tata-s and Skoda-s have to suffer in the wider hearsaid misperception.

    We have several such cases pop up (and disappear) suddenly on TFi, recently: people who want to save a buck by a kind of informational blackmail of a dealer or of Fiat, or people who actually are so ignorant of their car's maintenance needs that they genuinely attribute their own errors or bad luck to Fiat and FASS quality deficits.

    Have you had bad experiences recently with FASS, btw, why so paranoid, you don't know better from your experiences recently, since the independent FASS came up? They're not the best, but they're good enough and improving too, imo. Sounds like they've still to earn your full-enough trust.

    The Fiat mjd, the cars themselves as-a-whole do indeed have the longest service interval, the cheapest spares prices and the segment-lowest cost-of-ownership. Relative to Honda and Hyundai and Maruti: by a pretty LONG way.

    I'd urge you to do the comparative research on that before you start getting skeptically anxious.

    What was that I was saying in another thread about 'herd-think'?! The herd keeps repeating: if you are not buying/owning a M/HY/H/T: be anxious, be paranoid, be wrong.:p:confused: The herd is...your/my best friend, your/my dad (and mum), could be your/my brother (and sister) too, hell it could be your non-driving wife and teenage kid....:D Just make sure it's not...us!;)
  6. vista7155

    vista7155 Regolare

    Messages:
    305
    bangalore
    @prabhjot
    I have gone through the full thread which i have posted earlier and if you think that customers is at mistake for running the car without checking the engine oil then we are making blank statement and nobody in this world will check the engine oil level and start driving the car including me (i am confident that 90% will not check).

    Then what is the use of ASS? should we blame ourselves and that poor customer for trusting them for the Service and believe them for oil replacement?
    Please go through all the posts we can clearly see the Time chain which was perfect and damaged is occurred some where else and it has been recorded in all his mails to Fiat and one more thing is he has drove the vehicle for 1500 kms and enlighten me what is the use of world class technology where it is not able to sense the low oil level and kill the engine before any major damage?
    Then we have to blame Fiat where they have provided us this kind of Engine without any safety and expecting the customers to check the engine oil fortnight.
    FYI for Punto 75 HP now where Fiat has recommended to change the timing chain and will you buy the argument from SA, who recommends us to change the brake pads for every 15K and if we ask the reason for changing he will show us service manual and for above case do we still believe the SA words where he has recommended to change the timing chain but where as fiat it strongly recommends for 90 hp and Linea and not 75hp.

    Every customer(including me) will think twice before spending 13K for any repair and we have seen/read many instances how they have taken customers for ride.
    In between in the same thread we can see the same issue has been occurred for other poor customer where he has religiously followed the Timing chain change at 60K kms and still facing the same engine blowup and ended up getting the bill of 1.4 lakhs.
    I m pretty sure Fiat is taking for ride and also we justify that it may have happened to less customers, then we have to consider as Fiat quality manufacturing issue where it has failed within specified period.

    Regarding the reliability of MJD i have done comparative research where fiat recommends us to change the timing chain for every 60K kms and If its only lasting 60K kms that's isn't a bad engineering? then what is the advantage of moving from timing belt to the chain mechanism and we have tons of post in our forum and also around about the legendary 1.3 multijet Timing chain issues and also here we can find many fellow members as they have changed at 13K kms. .
    Fiat service team screwed up the Engine by advertising the 15K intervals without even thinking our Dusty condition and B2B traffic IMHO.

    And every car has the maintenance issues but as a customer we expect the company to come forward and help us out from these situations and take stringent actions against the dealer but in the above case it is other way around and Fiat washed their hands by giving 25% discount.
    We have Vista Petrol(26K kms),Dezire(85K kms) and Nano (16K kms) till now Vista and Nano are running with stock Brake pads and Dezire have seen one change at the interval of 43K and now my punto at 16.6K brake pads are near to death and may run another 2K as per SA comments ,I am not sure to buy his comments are not.

    And then asking about Why paranoid about the issue because it has happened in my city and i am alerting everybody to please spare one day of your time and be present while changing the important engine Oil and other stuffs and save from suffering a huge dent on the pocket as a consequence of the damage repair.

    Fiat service has improved in general with better spare part availability but if you are not careful with certain things, a few of the bad ones will rip you apart.

    I don't buy the argument that Fiat are cheap to maintain because any how i will end up spending the more money for Timing chain change,Brake pads for every 15K and normal maintenance etc.. and others will be in same range with 10K/12 months service interval.

    About the Bangalore FASS,have lost faith in them and their competency in resolving the issues, visited 3 times for simple horn issue(different ASS) and also still running behind them to sort my front shock observer sound issue created while 2nd service.

    I feel this post is OT and will stop here in further commenting about the issues for above case.
    @mods if you feel it is OT please remove it.
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2015
    prabhjot likes this.
  7. prabhjot

    prabhjot Esperto

    Messages:
    2,443
    delhi ncr
    @vista7155

    All I am saying is: go by your own direct experiences and those of knowing friends and acquaintances, not by hearsay and rumour, on the internet or otherwise. You're not too happy with the improved FASS, so your grumpiness is understandable.

    For every internet report of a flaw/defect in either product/build/material quality and ASS/warranties/spares in a Maruti, a Hyundai and a Honda you'll find 20 on fiat. Not because that reveals the 'true' picture but because Fiat owners and some non-owning fans actually are that much more knowledgeable, expectant, vocal, chatty and enthusiastic.

    Proof of that: the very healthy existence of TFi, unique in the Indian automotive culture.

    More proof: you'd have noticed that the number and length of the Fiat-related ownership threads on that other forum, compared to the number of M/HY/H/T: a ratio completely out-of-sync with the actual ratio between the actual real sales/ownership numbers.

    Fiats just get talked about and commented upon that much more, and therefore the extra mention on the net of say 'timing chain' issues is TOTALLY unrepresentative of the truth, which is that the mjd is a champion engine in terms of reliability. IF the timing chain is replaced as specified, if one takes the advice of a FASS technician who recommends it, IF oil changes and levels are maintained, etc.: i.e., elementary aspects of responsible car ownership are followed.

    Am not saying everything is well and good or perfect with Fiats and their dealers/FASS, just that the misperception and information-distortion about them (vice-versa for the 3-4 dominant firms) is indeed far too great, in the wider, 'common-sense' that prevails in the Indian car baazar.
  8. ccprakash

    ccprakash Regolare

    Messages:
    268
    Bangalore
    What I feel is atleast few basic things we need to check about the engine. so that later on there is no need to blame others. If you are not checking the pressure in tyres and running the car blaming FASS is not good.
    mangeshtendulkar and prabhjot like this.
  9. vista7155

    vista7155 Regolare

    Messages:
    305
    bangalore
    Checking tyre pressure is common thing and if something happens because of that and blaming ASS is a foolish job and nobody does that.
    We are talking about engine oil,Timing chain here where we believe that ASS/SA for the basic level of service doing it right in first place and in between we believe that every 15K kms oil will be changed with out any scams but asking the customer to check it makes no sense because we have lot off riders who doesn't know a thing about engine oil or Timing chain and expecting them to know about it, is asking too much IMHO. For example i am also noob in checking the timing chain noise where i can't confirm what is the sound difference we hear at cold start.
    So in order to help us, we have so called Qualified SA\ASS who is going to take care of the unknown issues which we are facing IMHO.
    If i remember correctly in MJD we have alert for engine oil as it says "Insufficient Engine Oil" if you have low engine oil then what is the use of this feature?
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2015
  10. asimpleson

    asimpleson Esperto

    Messages:
    2,998
    Heptanesia
    Linea 1.3
    php-startpage_image_check.php-img-3556-typ-design-size-250

    @vista7155, the onus of car maintenance is on the owner as much as on the SC. We had faced a similar problem with our Maruti Omni, which was always in 'pink of health' scratch-less condition as it went to the doc (MASC) even for a small sneeze. Still they managed to botch it up after like 13yrs of trouble free service and a very reliable car with a great big no. on Odo. Or should we say we were blind enough to see it go unnoticed. Actually it was our job too to make sure that the engine oil levels don't drop frequently, in which case it could have more to do with some leak somewhere. And also add to it the intermittent faulty oil indicator, which was messed up due to some wiring issues.

    At the most Fiat should have tried to investigate how such a thing happened pulling up all the records from their DMS. Still there are always incidents that are or can be untold, unnoticed by the owner or FASC. That is why I said bad luck. This issue is not relevant to Fiat Sales. But more like Fiat Authorized Service Centers/Points or Dealership Service Centers.

    Dear Mods, kindly move post #653 onwards to a more relevant section as has been requested earlier.
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