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Fiat Avventura - Test Drive & Review

Discussion in 'Avventura 1.3 90 HP' started by nkrishnap, Oct 19, 2014.

  1. prabhjot

    prabhjot Esperto

    Messages:
    2,444
    delhi ncr
    @Raj_pol

    You've got to sample stuff in the real world, and take price into account, rather than rely on internet figures.

    The 1.4 Fire's power and torque figures are what, relative to the Polo or the i20 Elite/Active? Better than one, in fact better than both, if I am not wrong! And cost (even without discounts)?

    The 1.2 Fire Punto sells at what relative to the Polo let alone the 1.2 i20 Elite? For pretty damn good city driveability (much better than the 1.4 Linea we have in the family, the 1.4 is a champion highway, in-gear and high speeding engine, though, or indeed often even the 75 mjd on the Punto you and I have!)

    The Ecoboost costs how much more than an mjd Avventura or indeed the Ford diesel? For less torque that comes in MUCH later, albeit with much more power? The t-jet has it beat for power, torque, its spread, less turbolag, and is MUCH cheaper. (I own both an mjd Punto Active and a Linea t-jet Emotion).

    Mefeels the Tata Revotron is THE perfect petrol engine for India (with this sub 1.2 litre excise duty rule), given its fantastic driveability and astoundingly low cost, followed closely by the t-jet, then the very expensive VW Tsi, and only then the Ecoboost.

    The Gurgaon tata dealer guy reports that demand for the mjd-equipped Zest is far higher, even now, though, despite deregulated fuel prices, btw.

    The Avventura and Evo t-jets will hardly add to sales because those who are even considering Fiats, willing to give them a chance in India,....will mostly just buy the mjd instead. Unless they can keep a big enough price difference between the two, which will be tough to do, imo. Why do you think Fiat didn't deploy it earlier? Why has it not sold much at all on the Linea, relative to the diesels? Hell, if the t-jet were not cheaper enough than the 90 mjd, even I'd have bought the diesel 2014 Linea instead, despite the low-monthly-mileage I have!

    India has more paper, and internet engine/performance/handling enthusiasts than real ones, I am afraid, as Fiat has been discovering, and will again, am afraid, when they launch the t-jet Evo+Avventura. By a factor of 10 to 1, at least!:p
  2. nikhil0405

    nikhil0405 Amatore

    Messages:
    117
    Pune
    Linea 1.3
    If I had to choose, it would be the avventura diesel over the ecosport ecoboost. The ecoboost titanium is nearly 10.5 L on road in Pune which does not make sense. The avvy is around 9.75 L on road ( source carwale).
    Moreover, if fiat launches the tjet avvy, expect it to be priced below the mjet avvy considering the current linea pricing. The ecoboost then makes little sense.
    Last edited: Apr 2, 2015
  3. dadasaheb

    dadasaheb Regolare

    Messages:
    374
    Pune
    MH 12 (Ranjangaon)
    Linea 1.3
    1.4 TJet for Avvy and Evo does not make any sense IMHO as it will to be under 24% excise slab, I fear that price of 1.4 TJet Avvy or Evo may cross price of Top end Mjd.
    instead 1.2 Revetron from Tata will make more sense in them may be in 120 HP tune when it will be available with Bolt sports :)
    Take Revetron from Tata and Mjd is anyway given to them.
    i think swapping % will be 10-90 with the diesel favorable market in India.
    why to waste resources and money for the testing and all the other stuff ?
    prabhjot likes this.
  4. Vidhyashankar Kannan

    Vidhyashankar Kannan Regolare

    Messages:
    271
    Hyderabad
    Hyderabad
    Avventura 1.3 90 HP
    The Revotron engine a new design from Tata. No one knows its longevity or issues. The MJD is time tested from the Jurassic era by so many customers and so many brands. It is well known to run for 3 lakh kms if kept well. Testing an engine is maybe the most important thing a company needs to do. For whatever crap customers dish out to Fiat in india, they still want that sweet engine in their cardboard bodied cars anyway.
    dadasaheb and prabhjot like this.
  5. prabhjot

    prabhjot Esperto

    Messages:
    2,444
    delhi ncr
    The great thing about Fiat in India is their ability to provide segment-leading build, suspensions, engines etc at fantastic prices. Unless they're retailing at a huge loss (even before discounts): cannot be.

    And so say a 50000+ price gap between the t-jet and 90 hp mjd on the Avventura should happen, i guess, given what they managed with the new Linea?

    And so, incremental sales increase+a few 'enthu' t-jet buyers can result?

    The thing is the Ecosport's 1.5 petrol is pretty good (140 Nm of torque, apparently), so i guess the t-jet's essential in that sense. Also: the gross Etios Cross and the funny i20 Active don't get great petrols.

    They really must advertise their engines in a big way, both t-jet and mjd, once the t-jet launches on the Avventura and Evo: on tv and in print, not just on the website or on youtube/facebook.

    It won't change sales numbers significantly in the short run, but will be a good way to boost the brand perception. Especially if the ad can also feature some new gizmos (gps touchscreen etc)?
  6. dadasaheb

    dadasaheb Regolare

    Messages:
    374
    Pune
    MH 12 (Ranjangaon)
    Linea 1.3
    I disagree with this as Linea overall either petrol or diesel attracts excise duty of 24%
    while Avvy and Evo diesel have excise slab of 12%
    if 1.4 T Jet is added to them then it will (petrols) attract excise slab of 24%
    I think that will surely cross the prices of diesel Avvy or Evo.
    lets see how it takes shape in future. :)
  7. adisrini1103

    adisrini1103 Amatore

    Messages:
    243
    Coimbatore
    Linea 1.3
    @dadasaheb isnt the EVO emotion and Avvy already has an excise duty of 24% because they have 1.4 petrols and not a 1.2??
    I dont think 1.4 NA and 1.4 turbo would have different excise duty
  8. dadasaheb

    dadasaheb Regolare

    Messages:
    374
    Pune
    MH 12 (Ranjangaon)
    Linea 1.3
    Fiat-Evo.png

    please see the pricing of Emotion Evo 1.4 petrol is more 4K than the diesel emotion
    add to it the price diff of FIRE and TJet.
    --- Double Post Merged, Apr 3, 2015 ---
    Fiat-Linea.png

    See there is difference of 99K in Active 1.4 FIRE and 1.4 TJet
    --- Double Post Merged, Apr 3, 2015 ---
    Fiat-Avvy.png

    But when it comes to Avvy I am shocked to see the price diff of around 70K between Active, Dynamic Petrol and Diesel.
    I am curious that isn't 24% excise applied to Avvy Petrol 1.4 ?
    then my mind says that is there a single unit of Petrol Avvy Fiat manufactured and sold it ??
    Last edited: Apr 3, 2015
    prabhjot likes this.
  9. adisrini1103

    adisrini1103 Amatore

    Messages:
    243
    Coimbatore
    Linea 1.3
    or they should get a maruti's 1.2 k12 engine (or) hyundai 1.2 which produces the same 89BHP and gives 20kmpl for 980Kg...
    funny thing they couldn't even make a 1.2 petrol but still make the national engine then the price would be 5.5 L for the base petrol
  10. prabhjot

    prabhjot Esperto

    Messages:
    2,444
    delhi ncr
    This is why I increasingly feel Fiat should go niche (i.e., sporty, with gizmo-s) and premium (Abarth 500, Abarth Punto, 500L, 500X, etc....ckd with partial localization, localized b-suv--the real Avventura--promised for 2016) with their new launches for 2016 and beyond (if at all). At much higher-than-mass-market list prices (say, Rs. 8-10 lakhs and WELL above), with fewer discounts.

    And, this is the essential bit: with correspondingly different branding, brand communication and dealership/FASS strategies/nature/locations.

    Playing this cost-price-'value' game in this car-market culture, with these excise duty rules, and given the state of the brand's 'equity' in the mass market in the face of the dominant ustaads at this game (MS, HY, H, T and even Tata) is so arduous and expensive as to be self-defeating? Even with all-new cars (say the Panda, or Nuvo Palio or the all-new Linea-replacement being tested in Europe currently).

    Unless they are willing to go all out and prepare 'third world specials' (tin cans with lipstick, one might say sarcastically)....but wait, that is even more self-defeating, since that sort of consumer is just the sort to ignore you in favour the trusted experts at that sort of car (MS, HY, H and T)!

    Caught between a rock and a hard place. Na ghar ka na ghat ka. etc etc!

    I'd welcome Fiat pricing the t-jet Evo and Avventura near or even above the mjd 90, then. With a couple of added gizmos of course.

    Provided: their advertising explicitly refuses to play this price-value game, and aggressively/emphatically takes a clear-cut sporty-young-free-expressive-fast-yet-knowing-and-cosmopolitan positioning. After all, they might as well give up this fearful timidity about costing-pricing: it hasn't helped them move numbers of Lineas and Evos, even with discounts of 1-2 lakhs, as we saw in december of last year!

    Stick to declared prices, don't discount: spend those monies on marketing instead. The competition are lakhs more expensive, despite being inferior. Feel free therefore to load up the cars with say ddct twin clutch gearboxes, and/or touchscreens and/or panoramic sunroofs, and feel free to raise prices a lot and stick to them (at least through to the very end of the year.)

    Provided the advertising pitch is different in quantity and quality. And vitally their dealership+FASS strategy is altered away from the mass and the unviable smaller-town markets.

    That way one would also prepare better ground for the more premium turn they should take starting 2016 with the b-suv (the ckd 500 line-up and Abarths). Fiat in India needs to follow Jeep up and away from the mass market over the next few years?!

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