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Do you agree with the Anna Hazare's methods?

Discussion in 'Hangout' started by gurjinder, Aug 18, 2011.


Do you agree with the METHODS being employed by Anna Hazare ?

Poll closed Oct 17, 2011.
  1. Yes

    39 vote(s)
  2. No

    12 vote(s)
  3. Not sure

    2 vote(s)
  1. First two pages in the list contains most known faces in Indian politics. Most of them have not signed the attendence register. Are they in paid leave or what?? (A. Raja can be excused as he can not attend :))

    Regarding Anna Hazare, my views are very much nutral as of now, as I am not very much into it. I would like to mention one thing here. Two months ago, I saw a fellow employee in my office bike parking. He was having two message boards, containing slogans for Anna Hazare and against corruption. He has one in his chest and one at his back. At that moment I thought it is current hot thing and that particular person will do it for a week and it will be over. I am wrong. I happened to see that person last week, on my way to office. I am surprised to see that he still had those message boards, and added to that he had our national flag hoisted in his two wheeler. With this kind of commited supporters Anna might win.

    I strongly believe that, we common people should stop bribing even at the lowest level is as important as punishing the scammers. The decipline should start from each and every induvidual. But (and this is a big but), are we able to get our rights or basic work done without bribing???
  2. royj

    royj Esperto

    That is one really valid point.. without that all our effort and support for this cause is meaningless.
  3. jayadev

    jayadev Esperto

    Kannur, India
    Grande Punto 1.3 90 HP
    "100/100 laoge tho ghadi varna chhadi." ..." if you want a bicycle come up with first rank in school otherwise do not show your face to me."

    "i dont care if you are hungry or not but if you want to watch that cartoon then drink this milk first."

    Bribing has tough roots in our very own education and upbringing systems. A kid learns bribery from very young age which remains in his or her mind forever.
    It is not easy to uproot bribery or corruption that easy but not impossible though.
  4. Pran

    Pran Superiore

    Grande Punto 1.3
    But you wont make the same offer to your neighbors kid, would you?
    Method may not be politically correct, but we cannot correct a politically wrong system politically, it has to be a mass movement like it is now.
  5. kaps

    kaps Superiore

    New Delhi
    New Delhi
    Linea 1.4
    Jayadev, by those standards, every human being is morally corrupt. We go to our places of worship and pay a bribe to the lord to take care of our problems. This is human nature. What Anna fighting against is systemic corruption. I heard on TV the other day and found it very relevant. From birth to death, every Indian is a victim of corruption. If you don't cough up, you are not even born. This is the decay and corruption that needs to be weeded out. Beginning has to be made by getting the government to govern and not rule, by making the administrative services to provide services and not turn into power centers.

    Problem is corruption has become so endemic and ingrained that we have started thinking it is alright to pay a bribe for something that the system must provide as a service to its citizens.
  6. Aanand

    Aanand Amatore

    The following article is relevant since in Hong Kong too the 'method' used seems to have been similar to that of team Anna's i.e. the Independent Commission Against Corruption (ICAC) was formed as a consequence of pressure created by the public's demonstrations on the streets.
    It seems unrealistic to expect politicians / bureaucrats to take such initiatives without pressure from the public.

    "India should learn a lesson from Hong Kong on tackling corruption"

    Hong Kong of 1960s and 1970s presented a picture quite similar to present-day India. While industrialisation was booming, governance was at its lowest ebb. Infrastructure lagged behind the economic growth as well as the population growth.

    Corruption boomed as entrepreneurs and contractors found the "backdoor route'' with government departments. Corruption was particularly rampant in the police force.

    At first, the people felt helpless but by early 1970s major discontent began to brew. Activists began persuading the government to take action against corrupt officials.

    Thousands of people joined in this cry. The proverbial last straw on the camel's back came when a corrupt expatriate police officer Peter Godber, who amassed assets worth HK$4 million. During the week when he had been given notice by the Attorney General to explain details of his assets, he managed to flee the country on June 8, 1973.

    Godber's escape unleashed a public outcry. Students spearheaded a mass rally in Victoria Park, protesting and condemning the government for failing to tackle the corruption problem. Demanding prompt government action, protesters took to the streets.

    Under pressure, the government was quick to take action. Sir Alastair Blair-Kerr, a senior judge, was appointed to form a commission of inquiry into Godber's escape.

    Sir Alastair, in his report, pointed out that unless an independent agency of anticorruption is set up, the people will never be convinced that the government is serious about fighting corruption.

    This led Governor Sir Murray MacLehose (who then was the head of the government) to vociferously advocate an independent anticorruption organisation in a speech at the Legislative Council in October 1973.

    Thus, the ICAC (http://www.icac.org.hk/en/home/index.html) was established in February 1974. The first job of the ICAC was to complete Godber's trial. He was extradited from England, found guilty of conspiracy and taking bribes, and sentenced to four years' imprisonment.

    This landmark judgment kicked off a new era of transparency in Hong Kong. Initially, newspaper editorials and cartoons poked fun and showed cynicism towards the ICAC, stating that if a corrupt head is in charge of it, there is no hope.

    However, when over 200 police officers were arrested in the first year itself on charges of corruption, people realised that the ICAC meant business. A survey 2010 showed that 95% of people had faith in the working of the ICAC.

    What has made ICAC successful has a lesson for India, which is in turmoil because of the Lokpal Bill. The ICAC right from its inception has adopted a strategy to fighting corruption on three fronts — the operations department, the corruption prevention department and the community relations department.

    In a recent public speech, Tony Kwak Man-wai, former head of operations for 27 years with the ICAC, stated: "One of (the ICAC's) success factors is its three-pronged strategy — fighting corruption through deterrence, prevention and education. All three are important but in my view, deterrence is the most important.

    That is the reason why in the ICAC's total establishment of over 1,300 staff members, over 900 of them work in the operations department, responsible for investigating corruption.'' He further states: "Nearly all of the major corruption cases I have dealt with were committed by people with high authority and good wealth.

    For them, they have certainly been educated about the evil of corruption and they may also be subject to certain degree of anti-corruption control. But what inspired them to commit corruption? The answer is simply greed, and they would weigh the fortune they could get from corruption with the chance of them being discovered.

    So how can we deter them from being corrupt? The only way is to make them realise that there is a high risk of them being caught, which is the mission of the ICAC operations department — to make corruption a high-risk crime. To do that, you need a professional investigative force."

    Prevention was held as an important issue. Another was to develop "new public consciousness'' because the "battle against corruption could only be won by changing people's attitude towards graft.'' The community relations department educates people against the evil of corruption.

    The ICAC's motto is 'fighting corruption without fear or favour'. The website, icac.org, also has a helpline for the citizen to report corruption. It also has a manual for foreign investors and Mainland companies, guiding them on how to start their ventures without corrupt practices.

    India has moved ahead in a myriad spheres. The people's patience in accepting corruption is waning. The government did well to enact the Right To Information Act.

    Now It must build on this goodwill and bring a very strong anti-graft draft. Accept most of what Team Anna says. It has the backing of India's conscience. When that happens, India will prosper.

    Every Indian, whether a neta or a babu or a businessman or a common man, will prosper. Without having to demand or receive bribe.
  7. bhai

    bhai Esperto

    Grande Punto 1.3 90 HP
    Visit to www.ipaidabribe.com

    Good website created by NGO where we can confess.

    You can mention about bribe taken & given by you without mentioning your name.
  8. jayadev

    jayadev Esperto

    Kannur, India
    Grande Punto 1.3 90 HP
    there is no individual "common people" thing anymore. if you do not bribe then next common guy will bribe and take your share too.

    i have bribed or being forced to bribe in railway station , Immigration counter,electricity office, Rto office, and in-numerous times to Cops on road.

    In railway stations if i did not pay 50-100 bucks to the TTR, he won't have enough time to avail me seats for my RAC ticket, seats which are already empty.

    in Immigration counter I will have to stay detained for few hours to days becuase My passport foreign stamp is not clear or pasport has slight damage(according to them), Rs.500-2000.

    electricity office-if i am present him with bottle of whisky they will come today itself to fix the broken line else they are very buzy for next 3 days.

    Rto office- the officer always remain buzy and out of office to sign my IDP if i give rs. 200 to clerk he will get it signed for me .

    cops - if everything and paper is alright then he need chai paani ka paisa- earlier it was rs.5. now it is Rs.50 and above.other wise my headlamp do not have black dot, 1 year old car tire is worn and unfit for govt road,same car is too much polluting, rash driving et al.

    If not a complete social Reform there is nothing sort of reformation on individual level.

    supporting Annaji is one way to tell this whole corrupt institution that we are all not asleep . If not this method we find another one soon.
    Present goverment and thier media propaganda will spread misinformation which we all expected. it is our indivdual responsibility to be aware of crooks.
    Last edited: Aug 25, 2011
  9. kaps

    kaps Superiore

    New Delhi
    New Delhi
    Linea 1.4
    Jayadev, you are right. If we do not pay bribe, the next person will surely pay it. Personally, I feel bringing lower bureaucracy accountable and showing them the fear of jail will break the back of corruption structure which starts from the clerk/havaldar/line man/TTR etc and goes right to the highest office of this country. I do not find any difference between hafta collecting mafia or chai pani collecting bureaucracy. Both are controlled by ruthless dons. Independent investigating and punishing agency alone can bridle these crooks. Whether or not this independent entity remain immune from corruption, is a different point altogether.

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