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Automotive psycology, philosophy & salavation

Discussion in 'Hangout' started by ENKI, Jan 14, 2012.


Best 4 Door Sports Saloon in the World

Poll closed Jun 1, 2013.
  1. Maserati Quattroporte

  2. Porsche Panamera

  3. Audi S8

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  4. Jaguar XJ

  5. BMW 7-series

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  6. Mercedes-Benz S-Class

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Multiple votes are allowed.
  1. ENKI

    ENKI Esperto

    Once reading an automotive review a few yrs back (i don't exactly remember), i came across the term "Soul & passion in a machine". Now that was a good food for thought. How come a non-living piece of iron can have soul & passion. These soul things have stopped getting in living things (obviously i am referring to Human,a Biological robot), how come a machine have that??

    Well it does. It took sometime to set my understanding right & develop a vision to
    spot that in a machine. Albeit a few machines/appliance are by nature, forbidden to have soul & passion for eg. refrigerator, TV or Washing machine but not so with cars. Unfortunately to majority, a car is still an appliance just like refrigerator, washing machine or a TV. If i would try to argument at a public place with a guy who is using an appliance, i would be advised to immediately visit a nearby mental hospital & start medication as soon as possible. That's why it is discussed only at TFI. If people can't get the point here, i am a "gone" case surely.

    Let's not talk about super cars which have to be utterly gorgeous to look at & with dream drive. Since i want to sound realistic, I would rather concentrate something real world which a middle class can buy, i mean B,C & D segments. Moreover, It will make us sound reasonable & not crazy. Let's be sporting, i mean national/international/branded/not branded/Stock/Modified, no hauls barred!!

    I must emphasize that intentions are not to hurt any non-enthusiast reader. His view is as important as yours or mine. You know why?
    South Americans say (same Mayans who are associated with calendars) that everybody's point of view is sacred. why? It's sacred because only the beholder can have it, no one else! in other word, everybody's
    point of view is "unique" & "unique" is god. So if some-one is interested in vehicles as much as he is interested in TV/Refrigerator/Oven, let's respect his view because it's sacred.
    But so is ours hence back to the point:mrgreen:.

    As far as i am concerned, the physical appearance of a vehicle is one of the most important aspect, so i would like to talk about the soul/passion in external appearance of a car at least for this time. It is also
    associated with a term "timeless" more often in magazine review which shouldn't be labelled so often but again magazine's view is sacred too:mrgreen:.

    I was trying to find combination of timeless beauty oozing passion & soul. To incorporate this "timeless factor", without an exception, i had to go past a few a years to find a design that can rhyme with today's design language & may be future. Actually I had no option since i can't perceive the future & what design's will our children will be fond of.

    Let's start something with the more recent appearance.
    Civic Type R 3.jpeg Civic Type R 1.jpeg Civic Type R 2.jpeg

    Do you think "Honda Civic Type R" looks futuristic (timeless)??
    I don't think it's futuristic (It's utterly gorgeous though of our times though). The theme that it's design seems to be inspired of is "Jet propulsion Dynamics (Arrow shaped)" which gives you the feeling that thing will move faster with better aerodynamic properties. It's not timeless. Why?
    what if physicist today crack the "anti gravity" concept :mrgreen:& be somehow able to overcome gravity, aerodynamics, friction etc.??? A person brought up in such a civilization may feel Civics futuristic design to be just awkward. Never the less Civic type R is one hell of a looker!!!
    But in search of more retro designs, i found a couple of great looking cars & most of them were Italians only (that's Why Italy is associated with Automotive passion & soul). Everything else just seemed like more of a daily commute that people preferred at that time.
    One such example is FIAT 600 Abarth from 1962 (50 Yr back!!). Let's have a look.
    Fiat 600 Abarth 2.jpeg Fiat 600 Abarth 1.jpeg

    Doesn't it look like an angry chubby but damn cute kid, whom you would like to pinch quietly at his back to make him more angry and irritated:mrgreen:.

    Here is Another one.
    Fiat 600 Abarth 3.jpeg

    The other-one could be Lancia Delta HF from 1979 (33 yrs as on date). Most of us weren't even born at that time & if we did, we would be knowing lesser about a car design that a cow. Look at this profoundly crafted piece of beauty which will not fall out of place even today. No one will mind driving it any where & be seen into it.
    Lancia Delta HF 3.jpeg Lancia Delta HF 1.jpeg Lancia Delta HF 2.jpeg

    That's an achievement & i am serious. You know why, let's check a some other designs from the same era from some other manufacturers & models from higher segments.

    Like Audi S80 from 1979
    Audi S80 2.jpeg Audi S80.jpeg
    Audi S80 won't mind to be in queue for whole day just to have Lancia's autograph:mrgreen:.

    Next in queue to Audi will be a BMW 3 series from 1979:mrgreen:.
    BMW 3series 2.jpeg BMW 3series 1.jpeg

    You see not too many automakers were very evolved with designing aspect with an exception of Italian automakers. Our subconscious mind knows that but our "left brain & ignorance" denies it. Hence people either love or hate Italian automakers. There is nothing as such neutral.

    Pls check my best ever favorite looking 4 door saloon, it's 2 doors & hatchback siblings & a car as a whole. It's not over-expensive but in fact pretty much a C-segment car although not sold in India (Damn India!!)

    Doesn't it talk to your subconscious?
    Alfa Brera 2.jpeg Alfa Brera 1.jpeg

    Does it give you a reason to live & rejuvenate?
    Alfa Brera 4.jpeg Alfa Brera 3.jpeg

    Doesn't this 159 sports-wagon make you fall in love with-in slowly but steadily?
    159 sportwagaon 1.jpeg 159 sportwagaon.jpeg

    Doesn't it make you helpless & surrender, don't resist, surrender:mrgreen:. This is what i call an Automotive Nirvana.
    159 4.jpeg 159.jpeg 159 2.jpeg 159 3.jpeg

    Do you think two accidental & heavy deformed cars of the same make can ever look beautiful when they are towed away? They do.

    It doesn't mean that only Italian can make good looking cars. Germans have come through a long way. They do know how to put together a car that can be appreciated by all. That is even more difficult because they are satisfying everyone (Enthusiast, Appliance user, commuter, a taxiwala, a status seeker etc etc).

    It has to flow like a river that is must for everyone.
    Audi A6 3.jpeg BMW 5 Series 1.jpeg BMW 5 series 2.jpeg Audi A6 1.jpeg Audi A6 2.jpeg

    But can it replace this??? Absolutely not:mrgreen:.
    159 5.jpeg 159 6.jpeg 159 7.jpeg

    Though every view is sacred, ours is more:mrgreen:!!
    How? Because "Multitude has always been wrong". Just like once people believed Earth to be a center of the universe & it'd flat. Sun rotates around the earth. Keep on with the list & you never reach the bottom.

    So if you ever end up in a minority because of your choices, never mind. Being in minority your view is most right & sacred:mrgreen:. So i will keep digging where else i can find Soul & passion expressions in a car?

    Stay in the minority, stay tuned for next update & god bless!
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2012
    19 people like this.
  2. ENKI

    ENKI Esperto

    FIAT Group 114 Yrs of innovations & milestones to automobile sector

    I have consolidated to the best of my ability all the major world's first by FIAT group, the milestone achieved throughout the history & their contribution to international automobile sector & make it a better place.
    Let me tell you something guys!! FIAT easily possess the richest history among all the automakers we hear today. The other automaker's FAN-BOY stuff will just get pissed off if they ever come to know 10% of it.
    I am sure, i didn't cover everything FIAT Group has achieved so far. You will be appreciated in case you bring forth something that you know.

    I have also tried to not the topic look like history lesson of school age, but tried it make it informative with least amount of reading.

    Fabricca Italiana di Automobili.jpg Giovanni Agnelli.jpg

    Established in 1899, Fiat is one of the pioneering founders of the Automobile industry. While some car companies started off making bicycles or repairing lawn mowers, Fiat scientists, engineers and designers have, since the beginning, been pioneering advancements in a variety of fields that include passenger cars, metallurgy, commercial vehicles, tractors, railroad equipment, aerospace and nuclear energy.

    The history of Fiat is one to be proud of. Come along as we take a look at some of the milestones that have helped shape the 20th century and beyond.


    1. 1913 Theta, which was the first production car in Europe to feature a complete electrical system as standard equipment

    2. The first car with a Mono-coque type body – the Lambda, produced from 1922 to 1931 also featured 'Sliding Pillar' independent front suspension that incorporated the spring and hydraulic damper into a single unit (and featured on most production Lancias until the Appia was replaced in 1963)

    3. 1948 saw the first 5 speed gearbox to be fitted to a production car (Series 3 Ardea)

    4. Lancia premiered the world's first mass produced full-production V6 engine, in the 1950 Aurelia earlier industry-leading experiments with V8 and V12 engine configurations

    5. It was also the first company to produce a V4 engine

    6. Lancia pioneered the use of independent suspension in production cars, in an era where live axles were common practice for both the front and rear axles of a car. They also developed rear Trans axles which were fitted to the Aurelia and Flaminia ranges

    Alfa romeo:

    1. Alfa Romeo's trademark double overhead cam engine was used for the first time in the 1914 Grand Prix car,[29] the first road car with such an engine the 6C 1500 Sport appeared in the 1928

    2. World's first twin cam+twin spark profile having other features most common in today's engines were world's first debuting in this engine.

    • Aluminum alloy engine block with cast-iron cylinder liners
    • Aluminum alloy cylinder head with hemispherical combustion chambers
    • Forged steel crankshaft running in five main bearings
    • Double overhead camshafts driven by a double row timing chain
    • Camshafts directly actuate valves via bucket tappets
    • Two inclined valves per cylinder with near central located spark plug
    • Inlet and exhaust valves separated by an angle of 80 degrees

    3. Alfa Romeo tested one of the very first electric injection systems (Caproni-Fuscaldo) in the Alfa Romeo 6C 2500 with "Ala spessa" body in 1940 Mille Miglia. The engine had six electrically operated injectors which were fed by a semi-high pressure circulating fuel pump system

    4. Mechanical Variable Valve Timing was introduced in the Alfa Romeo Spider sold in U.S. markets in 1980.

    5. Electronic Variable Valve Timing was introduced as world's first in the (Alfetta).

    6. World's first C-Segment, light weight car fitted with a powerful engine Giulia was debuted in 1962. The Giulia weighed about 1,000 kilograms. Engine capacities offered were 1.3-litre (1290 cc) or 1.6-litre (1570 cc). Various configurations of carburetors and tuning produced power outputs from about 80 to about 110 bhp (in 1962!!). 0-100 was 10-12 secs in different configuration with a top speed of 180 Km/hr. That car is fast enough even by today standards.

    7. Debut of CRDI technology in 147 & 156 cars

    8. Direct injection technology for petrol engines

    9. First D Segment car as a FWD version with intelligent (Electronic) suspension & stabilization control with a Torque transfer technology to the front wheels in Alfa Romeo 164

    10. Introduced independent suspension for FWD cars on Alfa Romeo 164.


    1. 1920: Introduces double overhead cam (DOHC) engine is installed in the Fiat 801/402 race car
    2. 1927: Fiat patents a new front strut suspension that consists of a strut/shock with concentric spring, lower "A" arm and separate anti-roll bar. Twenty years later, Earle S. MacPherson re-invents it (What the Hell..!!:A)
    3. In 1927, aluminum cylinder heads are adopted on production model cars, representing a world first. the 520 was offered in left-hand drive and in 1928
    4. 1930, the arrival of the “Littorina”, the world’s first rail car by FIAT.
    5. 1942: the first diesel-powered heavy crawler, launch of the 700D wheeled tractor and the model “50”, The latter is hidden underground for fear of requisition by the Germans. It is recovered at the end of the war and mass production begins

    6. World's first ethanol powered mass produced car in 1979 (FIAT 147)
    7. Technology Exhaust gas recirculation to enhance efficiency of petrol engine was debuted in 1984.
    8. 1987: the world’s first direct-injection diesel engine for passenger cars is developed
    9. World's first Galvanized vehicle (1989 Tipo)
    10. World's first capable car to run on 4 different fuels (Siena Tetra fuel), a four-fuel car developed under Magneti Marelli of Fiat Brazil. This automobile can run as a flex-fuel on 100% ethanol (E100); or on E20-E25 blend, Brazil's normal ethanol gasoline blend, on pure gasoline or pure CNG
    11. World's first Semi automatic gearbox
    12. World first Hydraulic valve actuation debuted in Alfa Romeo Mito 2010 (Multiair)
    13. World's first all Aluminum engine


    1. 1907: Fiat builds its first marine engine, a diesel fueled, four cylinder unit. The French Grand Prix, Targa Florio and Emperor's Cup in Germany are won this year.

    2. 1908: the company begins manufacture of aircraft engines: the first developed is the 50hp SA 8/75, an overhead valve, air-cooled V8 which incorporates the experience acquired on the auto racing circuit

    3. 1910: six new models are launched: the 12-15 HP, 15-20 HP, 20-30 HP, 30-45 HP and the Type5 and Type6

    4. 1912: Fiat builds its first submarine engine

    5. In 1914, as a part of the first world war effort, almost 20,000 units of the 18BL lorry are produced and, in the years following, various aircraft engines. Fiat builds a marine engine that tops 5,000 horsepower

    6. 1915-1917, The Group enters the steel and railway sectors, construction begins on the Lingotto factory, the largest in Europe at the time.

    7. 1917, Fiat builds an airplane that climbs to over 20,000 feet

    8. 1934, Francesco Agello reaches 709.209 kilometers per hour in a Macchi-Castoldi M.C.72 powered by a Fiat AS6 engine, setting a world record for propeller-driven seaplanes that remains unbeaten even today

    9. 1940: the Fiat 016 locomotive exceeds 160 kilometers per hour, breaking the world speed record in the diesel engine category at that time

    10. 1951: the transatlantic liner Giulio Cesare, powered by a Fiat engine, enters service and Italy’s first jet, the Fiat G.80, takes flight

    11. 1952, the high-performance 8V sports car reaches 200 kilometers per hour and the 7002 model helicopter is presented

    12. 1954, launch of the 1400, Italy’s first diesel-powered passenger car

    13. 195, 6The Fiat G.91 is selected as tactical fighter for NATO:eek:

    FIAT 6.91 Tectical Fighter.jpg

    14. 1963: the worlds most powerful diesel engine with 32,500 horsepower, Fiat 9012 S marine engine goes into production.

    15. 1964, Fiat Ferroviaria designs and produces the Pendolino, the world’s first tilting train

    16. it outstripped Volkswagen, its main European competitor, and in 1968 produced some 1,750,000 vehicles while its sales volume climbed to $2.1 billion

    17. 1992: Lancia Delta HF retires from racing with 46 World Rally Championship victories and a record six times constructors' championship titles from 1987 to 199


    18. Pioneer in CNG powered vehicles since late 1990s

    19. FIAT won the European car of year awards 12 times. More than any-one else in the world.
    14 people like this.
  3. vivek_lko

    vivek_lko Amatore

    @ENKI you should definitely try your hand in Automotive journalism. You have a very lucid way of putting things!!
    1 person likes this.
  4. amit

    amit Superiore

    Navi Mumbai
    I think we should keep what Lancia and Alfa Romeo achieved before their take over by Fiat out of Fiat's capabilities.

    From what I know, Fiat took over Lancia in 1969 & Alfa Romeo in 1986.
  5. Ashpalio

    Ashpalio Amatore

    Grande Punto 1.3
    This was a super topic to read and know more of Technological progress by these companies. Once again great share. Thanx
  6. prakhar_lfc

    prakhar_lfc Superiore

    Bhubaneswar, Odisha, India
    Bhubaneswar, Odisha, India
    Linea T-Jet
    Very well written ENKI!

    I too feel that cars have emotions.

    My Linea was lying unused since December. Whenever I looked at her I felt as if she is saying, "Please take me for a long drive, I am getting bored standing here."

    When we took her for a spin last weekend, she seemed to be very happy. :)
  7. ENKI

    ENKI Esperto

    Thanks guys. I think every FIATian should be proud of what FIAT's history has been. I haven't even included Ferrari & Maserati, the biggest of them

    @Amit, Thanks for the suggestion. I was also confused since i was willing to post Lancia/Alfa Romeo achievements too. I request you to edit the post by mentioning a note at that top with "the years of acquisitions of all FIAT's subsidiaries".
  8. ENKI

    ENKI Esperto

    Murder & raping of ethics of automotive history

    Well the subject is pretty much unexpected but it does make sense. Does all we see & hear is exact? Let's take eg. of an organization where a Catering vendor had an idea which he couldn't hold in & discussed with chief of R&D section. The R&D section chief with a smile tells him to do what he is expected to do. This is all bullshit!
    As soon as the guy leaves, there he organizes meeting with his colleagues & gosh, concept makes sense & have been patented. Later on it changes the world altogether. One morning, the catering vendor was going through newspaper in a hurry & there he sees the face of Chief of R&D & his ground breaking research! This world is cruel, isn't it?
    I was confused whether there is some truth at all anywhere if we wish to go in deep. Fortunately i got a few & here i go.

    1. Who was the inventor of Internal combustion engines or free piston engines. In docs, it is Nikolaus Otto.

    1857: Eugenio Barsanti & Felice Matteucci describe the principles of the free piston engine where the vacuum after the explosion allows atmospheric pressure to deliver the power stroke (British patent No 1625). He even patented it & the docs were lost mysteriously. Eugenio caught some flu, could not be diagnosed & died mysteriously:(.

    I even managed to dig out know who are thieves here?
    When Nikolaus Otto patented his engine, Matteucci unsuccessfully argued that he and his partner Barsanti were the originators. He tried to fought it out but gave up later due to unknown reasons.

    2. CRDI technology: The common rail system prototype was developed in the late 1960s by Robert Huber of Switzerland and the technology further developed by Dr. Marco Ganser at the Swiss Federal Institute of Technology in Zurich. Later on FIAT - Magnetti Marelli - Elasis harnessed mixing it with modern elements like piezoelectric injectors with more no. of accurate injections & maintaining high pressure (1,800 bar/26,000 psi) during injection cycles, Integrating ECU aided fuel management system. For the mass production, investment was required. Their ongoing financial crisis forced them to sale the rights to Bosch for mass production. Obviously FIAT would manage to launch their new vehicles as soon as possible to rescue themselves without any operational costs for new diesel engines. The only back-draw though, As soon as FIAT debuted Alfa Romeo 156 JTD in 1997 & people were about to praise it's ground breaking diesel engines, there launches Merc Benz C class C 220 CDI a month later:mrgreen:.
    We know very well what is the situation today. Diesel engines are all about CRDI technology instead of being opposite.

    3. The big fat Predator of all, General Motors: In 2000s They use to sell hardly any diesel vehicle in Europe, simply because they were rubbish. They formed an alliance with FIAT, took over OPEL, got the control of FIAT diesels & left them into dust & paid 2 billion dollars as compensation. Their sales of diesel vehicles rose over 2 million in 2010 in the shape of OPEL with majority being diesel. Do those 2 billion dollars hurt? Hell no!!
    GM to create new diesel unit as it untangles its Fiat joint powertrain operations - Autoweek

    Marchionne said that the way GM dusted them, while returning to Turin, he was all blank in his mind & couldn't gather himself for a week. All he said to his employees, We received 2 billion dollars & may launch our new vehicles to rescue ourselves but we have to keep flying & flying because we don't have any ground to land on:confused.

    He turned FIAT's fortunes with-in 5 years. In 2010, when GM was about to be bankrupted & offered OPEL to FIAT, Marchionne was like .... Ummmmm, okkkk... wait.... may be.... no, thanks:cool:!

    4. Ferrari-Mclaren: How one can forget the prancing horse, what the dreams are made up of!!

    Of all the coffee shops in all of England, Trudy Coughlan had the rotten luck of walking into Document Image Processing. It was June 2007 in sleepy Surrey County, and Coughlan, a statuesque blonde, sauntered through the door of the shop holding a sheaf of 780 pages. Scan them onto two CD's, she told the clerk, a forgettable middle-aged guy in a forgettable office park in the middle of nowhere. Nothing strange about the order, unless you happened to be a Formula One fan and happened to take a close look at the material: schematic drawings, technical reports, pictures, and financial information — enough insider dope to design a Formula One race car. Each page was emblazoned with one of the most famous logos in the world: the prancing black horse of Ferrari.

    Surrey is McLaren country, just down the road from what locals call the Spaceship, the futuristic, top-secret, half underground headquarters of the McLaren Formula One racing team. But as it happened, the copy clerk was a rabid Ferrari fan — among the legion who worshipped Ferrari's star F1 driver Michael Schumacher and agonized over the fact that the Ferrari team was lagging behind top-ranked McLaren that summer.

    "Trudy Coughlan," the woman said when he asked her name.

    When she left, the clerk Googled.

    First he Googled Trudy Coughlan and discovered she was the wife of Michael Coughlan, chief designer of ... McLaren's Formula One racing team.

    Then he Googled Ferrari until he found the name and email address of the company's Formula One sporting director, Stefano Domenicali, in Maranello, Italy.

    "Dear Mr. Domenicali," the clerk typed. He proceeded to spill the strange tale of the woman with the stack of what appeared to be top-secret Ferrari documents.

    The next morning, as Domenicali sifted through his inbox, he came to the missive from Surrey. He immediately forwarded it to Ferrari security.

    A few days later, Trudy Coughlan picked up the two CDs, along with the 780 pages of documents. Following her husband's instructions, she destroyed the papers in a home shredder and burned the remains in their back garden.

    Thus began the biggest scandal ever to rock the world of Formula One racing.
    Do i need to tell how the blonde wife of chief designer managed to snatch the docs from some Ferrari technocrat;-)? This adrenaline rush doesn't only produce Ferrari's but can make one completely blind for a women:uh.

    5. Fiat patents a new front strut suspension that consists of a strut/shock with concentric spring, lower "A" arm and separate anti-roll bar. Twenty years later in 1947, Earle S. McPherson re-invents it & documents it forever with his name embarked on it:lol.
    Last edited: Mar 8, 2012
    1 person likes this.
  9. Cinju

    Cinju Esperto

    Amazing stories. Fiat seems to be much much bigger than what I used to think. Thanks a lot for the post Enki :nicethread . Maybe you can give reference links so that there wont be any confusion regarding the genuinity of your post.
  10. ENKI

    ENKI Esperto

    Last edited: Mar 8, 2012

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